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TMHS 793: Strengthen Your Mental & Emotional Fitness Through the Power of Creativity – With IN-Q

TMHS 594: Unlock More Happiness, Health, & Success In Your Relationships – With Jairek Robbins

“The giving of love is an education in itself.” – Eleanor Roosevelt

I believe that our relationships are one of the most influential factors in determining our mental health, success, and overall well-being in life. No matter your relationship status or personality type, communicating effectively with others is a critical skill you need to operate in our world today. On today’s show, you’re going to learn how to cultivate high-quality relationships so you can level up your happiness, health, and success. 

On this episode of The Model Health Show, I’m sitting down with Jairek Robbins. Jairek is a best-selling author, performance coach, and the president of Success Enterprises. He has taken five years’ worth of relationship courses and today he’s sharing the most impactful principles that you can use to become a master of relationships. This interview is full of actionable steps you can take today to improve your relationships. 

You’ll hear exactly how to become a better listener and how to implement the principles of teamwork in any relationship. We’ll talk about how our physiological inputs can affect our communication skills, and how to efficiently verbalize your feelings. I hope these tips will impact the way you communicate and help you connect more authentically with the people around you. Enjoy! 

In this episode you’ll discover:

  • What inspired Jairek to become a master of relationships.
  • How to bring your most authentic self to a first date. 
  • The three things we pick up throughout our lives, and how they evolve over time.
  • What the three different types of stories that inform our lives are. 
  • Why understanding someone’s stories is like gaining an awareness of your heartbeat. 
  • The power of reflecting on the past thirty days. 
  • How our past triggers can impact our relationships.
  • The three components of a great relationship. 
  • How to find alignment with your partner. 
  • The importance of teamwork in any relationship. 
  • Why defining roles and responsibilities can help a partnership flourish.
  • The fastest way to ruin a relationship.
  • Why you should keep a pulse on your partner’s sleep habits.
  • The four steps of listening. 
  • An important rule for communicating your feelings. 
  • How men and women tend to cope with hurt feelings differently.
  • Why a sleep deficit can lead to more conflicts. 
  • The four different reasons why people choose to be in a relationship.
  • What it means to master your craft. 


Items mentioned in this episode include:

Thank you so much for checking out this episode of The Model Health Show. If you haven’t done so already, please take a minute and leave a quick rating and review of the show on Apple Podcast by clicking on the link below. It will help us to keep delivering life-changing information for you every week!


SHAWN STEVENSON: Welcome to The Model Health Show, this is fitness and nutrition expert Shawn Stevenson and I'm so grateful for you tuning in with me today. Our relationships have a huge impact on our mental health, on our physical well-being, on our diet choices, on our success in life, there isn't a part of our life experience that isn't impacted by our relationships. The rub is today relationships are more complex than ever, but at the same time, there are some really profound principles that reign true regardless of the relationship context. So today is going to be all about upgrading our relationships, so that we can upgrade our happiness, upgrade our health and well-being, and upgrade our success and our lives. And in the episode today, you'll find out just how much are physiological needs impact how we show up in relationships. So, the health of our brain, our cognitive performance, our blood sugar, all of these things are going to be a factor.


And every single day I'm intentionally fueling my brain with proven nutrition to really help up level my cognitive performance and also for my loved ones as well, because when everybody's brain is firing on all cylinders, good stuff tends to happen versus when our brains are nutrient-deprived and we have a reduction in circulation, in nourishment, in nutrition getting to areas of our brain like our prefrontal cortex, that's responsible for social control, for distinguishing between right and wrong, for decision-making.


Should we do a thing? Should we not do a thing? Should we say a thing? Should we not say that thing... And it's understanding that the brain itself has a different nutrition profile than the rest of our bodies. We have the blood-brain barrier that only allows in a couple of dozen nutrients, there are countless nutrients that come in through foods, many that we still haven't even identified and isolated yet, but only a couple dozen that we know for certain is able to traverse the blood-brain barrier and actually fuel our brain cells. And one of those key nutrients is medium-chain triglycerides. Researchers at Yale University published data purporting that, medium-chain triglycerides, or MCTs, can readily cross the blood-brain barrier and instantaneously be utilized by our brain cells in a remarkable study that was recently published in the Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences, sought to find out if these MCTs could have an impact on one of the deadliest conditions.


This is now in the top 10 leading cause of death here in the United States: Alzheimer's disease, which is a degradation of our cognitive function to the degree, and this is one of those very tough things that if you don't have first-hand experience with a family member experiencing this degenerative brain disease, it's really difficult to articulate just how tragic it really is. And this does not have to happen at the level that it's happening today, there's so much that we can do now in prevention. However, now, when we look at the situation of somebody being diagnosed with Alzheimer's and the onset of the disease is taking place is largely considered a decline, it is just you being able to find a way through conventional treatments to slow the decline. It isn't largely accepted that you can do anything to help reverse this condition, and this is really interesting because these researchers...


Again, this is published in the Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences. They wanted to find out if MCTs could have an impact on improving the conditions of patients with Alzheimer's, and this was really interesting because the researchers were working to find out if MCTs could help to reverse this condition in any way. Now, it's widely accepted that part of Alzheimer's is a type of insulin resistance that's taking place within the brain itself, and what the researchers uncovered was that since MCTs are able to quickly be metabolized by the liver, prompting the production of ketones, these ketones are then able to cross the blood-brain barrier and provide an alternative fuel source for the glucose-impaired brain cells of Alzheimer's patients. And the scientists found that the consumption of MCTs directly led to improved cognitive function, improved cognitive function, not just slowing it down, but improving cognitive function in mild to moderate forms of Alzheimer's disease and cognitive impairment. Are you utilizing MCTs yet? Go to, that's the MCTs that I use exclusively. They're sourcing things the right way, and there's no nefarious ingredients, no binders, fillers, no nefarious extraction methods they are doing stuff the right way.


Go to That's, you get 10% off their incredible MCT oil, and they also have emulsified MCT oils as well. It's sort of like a coffee creamer, really easy to mix into coffees and teas and things like that. So huge fan of MCT oil, I had some today, most days it's how I'm starting my day, my first nutrition input after having water to start the day. When I have my first nutrition input, I'm having MCTs along with coffee or tea. And the science affirms how effective it really is. So go to, now let's get to the Apple Podcast review of the week.


ITUNES REVIEW: Another five-star review titled “love this podcast” by beautyjunky1388. “I can't believe it has taken me four years to finally give this review, I love this podcast so much. I talk about it almost daily and have turned to so many of my friends and family onto it. Shawn has the best way of making complicated topics very simple to understand and motivates me to be the healthiest person I can be. Thank you so much for all that you do, Shawn. You're amazing.”


SHAWN STEVENSON: Thank you so much for leaving me that review over on Apple Podcast, I appreciate it immensely. And if you get to do so, please pop over to Apple Podcast and leave a review for the Model Health Show. And on that note, let's get to our special guest and topic of the day. Our guest today is best-selling author, coach, and now the President of Success Enterprises, which includes Success Magazine,, Success Coaching, and other entities.


And I'm talking about the one and only Jairek Robbins. He is somebody who walks his talk, and I always love spending time with him, he over delivers, over gives, and just has a heart of gold. Truly appreciate the insights because we're talking about something that we're both very passionate about, and that is having high quality healthy relationships. So, let's jump into this conversation with the amazing Jairek Robins. My God, Jairek Robins, I'm so happy to see you. So, you did a content piece recently talking about being a master of relationships, or are you a disaster of relationships? So, let's talk about what that means.


JAIREK ROBBINS: Yeah, I learned it from a course I was taking. And so, I had gone through five years of relationship courses before I met my wife, and the reason I had gone through it is for some reason, my relationships I was in just wouldn't last more than three or four months, just something would happen and it would just hit a speed bump and kind of dissolve, and I couldn't figure it out. And so, I got frustrated, and any time I get frustrated, I have a process and a way I learn things or go about trying to figure something out, which is 'learn it, live it, give it'. And so, I just went into deep learning mode, so I started to get every book, every program, every tape, every course, everything I can get my hands on and just consume and figure out, Okay, what are the similarities? What are the patterns? Usually there's patterns in courses and books and tapes and programs, where you start to see the thread, the through thread. That's... It is the same in all of them. You go, ah, there's the truth. That's my through thread, where the truth lies, where ah these are the common principles that are in every single program. And as I started to learn the common principles and the common threads on that truth line, all of a sudden, I started to see: Ah, here's the things I was messing up on.


Here's the things I didn't quite understand. Here's the things that make the most difference. And so about five years in the studying and learning, I finally had met my wife. Now when I met her, I had heard certain things that I was practicing at the time. One was never go on a first date by yourself, 'cause you won't be yourself. I went, what does that mean? Never go on a first date by yourself 'cause you won't be yourself. When you're around someone that you feel attracted you or are wanting to present your best to... You're not presenting the most authentic and true part of yourself, you're presenting the best part of yourself, the highlight reel, the Instagram version of you. And so, what happened was, I met her. The introduction was kind of fun 'cause we were at a house party in San Diego. I don't drink, I don't party. Wasn't my place. My neighbor had a big fun party, she came across, she's like, "Come on, you're coming over and meeting people." I was like, "Okay." So, she dragged me out of my house working on a project, I grabbed a protein shake on the way out the door 'cause I didn't want to have to explain why I don't have a drink, and then I met some cool people there.


As we were talking, I think I met the guy who created BarkBox. He was a cool dude. We were chatting about the origins and how he was packing all the boxes in his garage and mailing these things out, and so we were having fun conversations, meeting cool people. And then my wife, Amanda had arrived, and my neighbor Molly went and grabbed her. I didn't learn this out of the story till later, but she grabbed her... She said, Girl, put a smile on your face, I'm about to change your life. And so, she grabbed her... She's like, "Woah, woah, woah, I'm not trying to meet people. I'm good." She's like, "No, trust me." Grabbed her, pulled her across, pushed her into me, and the introduction was: This is Amanda. She loves to travel. She volunteers a lot, and she used to live in Asia somewhere. And she goes: This is Jairek. He volunteers a lot. He loves to travel, and he used to live in Africa somewhere. Anyways, you two have fun. And walked away. And we stared at each other, and in Southern California, when someone says they travel, there's kind of a range Vegas, San Fran, maybe Hawaii, probably Tijuana or Mexico in some way.


That's, there's kind of a range. And so, I said, "Oh, you travel, like where have you been?" She's like, "Oh, I used live in Bali. I was studying business in Thailand. I did some intern work with... In China," and she kept going down the list. I was like, oh my gosh, she really travels. That's cool. And I was like, "You volunteer. What kind of volunteer work do you do? 'Cause people, you know, help out at church on Easter or something like that." She's like, "No, I was Make-A-Wish, Wish-Granter of the year last year." I was like, woah, okay. And four and a half hours later of just in a little bubble, just talking, talking, talking... Four and half hours later, I looked at her I'm like, I'm hungry. She's probably hungry. I was like, "Are you hungry?" She's like, "Yeah, so let's go get some food." And the thing clicked in my head when you go on a first date, never go by yourself 'cause you won't be yourself. And so, my friend Alex was there, Alex is always hungry. So, I hit, and I was like, "Dude, you hungry." He's like, "Yeah, man." I was like, "You want to go get some tacos?" He's like, "Let's do it."


And so, the three of us went on a first date, and it was interesting, just the concept of when you're around someone... Like for me it's Alex, that I'm a goofball with, I'm silly, we do stupid stuff, we're funny together, we're ourselves, the most authentic version of ourselves. That's who she got to meet on that first time, and I have a picture, 'cause Alex is very silly. He had a mustache app at the time, so he took a picture of us at dinner and put a mustache on her and showed it to me. He goes, "Here's the real test, if you still think she's cute with a mustache, you got a good one." I still have that picture. It's our very first date.


SHAWN STEVENSON: That's incredible, man. I love that so much. Because you just said a real powerful truth, this isn't just even in dating, but even in a job interview. Right?




SHAWN STEVENSON: We're bringing forth our representative. It's somebody who is our representative... It's not our true authentic self. But when you can start to merge that more in your real day-to-day life, there's a peace that takes over, because at first, it's very unpeaceful because we've been trained to put on this representative. And so, we're kind of on guard all the time, and we have to remember who am I supposed to be? Versus this piece comes over you where you never have to get found out that you're not this person or you're not all this person, is such a great piece of advice. And it made me think of my oldest son, he was just talking about his friend was out with a girl and he was with them. And he's just like, "Bro, why are you acting like this?" 'Cause he was acting different, and so, by him prodding him, his friend got more into his bag of being himself. Right?


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right.


SHAWN STEVENSON: So, this is so brilliant, I never even thought about that.


JAIREK ROBBINS: I don't know if you all can clip to a piece, there's a piece of Kim Kardashian in the car where they're driving, and she calls to leave a voicemail and her voice totally changes. And then her sister calls her out on it, and she's like, "Hey, we're just heading to dinner." And the sister's like, "Man, you're totally different." She's like, "No, I'm not." But it's a funny little clip where you see the projection of who someone tries to be in that moment. Now, what's interesting, a little side psychology piece here, if you think of psychological development of humans, let's just do three stages, like 13 to 28, 29 to 35, 36 to 45. At each stage of development, we pick up three main things: stories, beliefs, and habits. And so, think back to a habit, you had it like 15-year-old you. Now, when everybody thinks back to a habit, you had at 15, like I had a habit of collecting basketball cards and shoes and jerseys and stuff. And I look forward now and I'm like, man, if I still had that habit, my house would look really different right now. I'd have a lot of posters on the wall, which luckily, my wife probably wouldn't like it, but it was a habit back then that served me.


That wouldn't necessarily serve me right now. Like it was an evolutionary habit I picked up and then let go of along the way. Now that's the one I let go of. Now, rewind and think of a habit that you still carry with you from 15 years old or 16 or 17 or 18. Some of us picked up habits that have made a monumental positive difference in our life all these years. Some of us picked up habits that have completely wrecked some part of our life. And so, when you get together with someone in a relationship, one thing to be deeply curious about is what are the habits they continue to bring with them all these years, what are the tried-and-true habits that make this person who they are? Not what they do every once in a while, but what they do all the time. Second part: Stories. There's three kinds of stories. There's internal stories, so think back to like 19-year-old you, what's the story you told yourself about who you thought you were? That's a funny story. Did you think you were tall, strong, funny, big, small, aggressive, strong, powerful? Who did you think you were at 16, 17, 18, 19 years old?


The story, the narrative you came up with about who you were, an identity statement, could be another way to say it, but it's a narrative and ongoing story. Then pause that one and look, what was the story you told other people about who you were, and did they match? Did who you thought you were and who you said you were match at that stage of your life? And then the third story, the brand story, who people thought you were when you weren't around, who people talked about and said you were when you weren't there. I went back and found someone that knew me at 15 years old, and I said without me saying a word, I just have a big question, spend some time thinking about it, shoot me a message back when it hits. And the question was, who was I at 15? You knew me, you observed me. Who was I? Describe me. Give me like the top 10 things of the way you described me. And the way that she described me was totally different than how I thought about myself. And then when I wrote down, I tried to kind of channel the 15-year-old me and said, okay, if I was going to describe myself, at 15 of who I thought I was and how I would say it out loud, what was that? And I was like athlete, basketball player, a champion, like all these things, and then I look at like the picture of 15-year-old me, I was five foot nine, 225 pounds, big old round cheeks, long hair.


I was like, that's not how I remember it. But what's interesting is, as it evolved, I had to look at that first stage. Three stories, who I thought I was, who I said I was, how I was actually perceived and experienced. Second stage, same thing. Third stage, same thing. And what's interesting is looking back and realizing how the stories evolved, why they evolved, and what kept consistent, what let go or what shed off over the years. That part was fascinating. And so, as your son's growing, he's going through these stages, and at each stage, you can become conscious, meaning you can pick up a pen and paper and say, who am I going to choose to be during this next stage of my life? Or you can just do it and have to reflect back and say, wow, who was I? And so, one gives you immense power when you pick up the pen and you have the ability to actually write the future of who you're about to be and decide consciously. The other one is more a reflection where you can kind of learn from it and evolve and get better because you're already through it.




JAIREK ROBBINS: Final piece. So, habits, stories, third one is beliefs. Beliefs are just the foundation to support everything, meaning the table legs that hold up the table of your life. And so, at each stage, I always use the example 'cause they're big bold statements, and right now it's kind of interesting to say this out loud, just 'cause how people are trying to figure it out again in history, but if I were to say, "All men are... " Without saying another word, people instantly have thoughts. And I go, okay, well, how about this one? "All women are... " People instantly have thoughts. And then you have to stop, write them all down and say, okay, when did I start believing that? Where did that come from? Who taught me that? Where did I learn that? And then say, okay, is it Byron Katie? Is it true? And you're like, well, for me, it's true, 'cause that's what I believe. You go, great. By believing that, will that help you evolve into the person you're trying to be? Or is that something that's going to anchor you back in the past and not let you move forward?


SHAWN STEVENSON: Wow, that's powerful.


JAIREK ROBBINS: And so, what's interesting is when you meet a human, that's not the conversation 99.999% of people have. You say, "Tell me about yourself," but what you don't say is, "Hey, help me understand the narrative you created about yourself over all these years. I want to understand why you did that, why you thought that. Help me understand the beliefs you've evolved through over these years, and why do you believe what you believe now. Help me see the habits you have of what makes you you. 'Cause if I could understand all of that, my gosh, wow, I can see how well we could align or not align on some really, really important things here."


SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah, our perspective is our reality, and our narrative, like we always have a narrative. When you said those words, "All men are... " And I just thought about the spectrum of responses that can come from that based on our life experience, based on our perception. For me, it was "all men are created equal". That came up, and then I thought about the second tier down, "all men are dogs". That one, I'm just like, we hear that a lot. "All women are beautiful" that's what popped up for me. But when we understand that we are really a conglomeration of our life experiences, our perceptions, our choices, but I don't want to miss this because the thing that you said was, we can intentionally do this, we can proactively intentionally write our story.


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Versus it just kind of happening. For most of us, this stuff is just happening. You don't realize that we have the ability to shape what's to come is, right? We kind of understand, my choices are going to affect my future, kind of like a distant thing, but we don't realize like, no, literally, when you get clear on what you want, you can start to make that your reality.


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right, that's right. And so, it's interesting for most people, somewhere around 45 years old is where they very first time take out a pen and paper and consciously start thinking through this on paper. I got a head start. My family was into this stuff very early. I was in my mom's belly when she was learning about these types of things, so I got a head start on this one, and I've been doing this work for years and years, and it still took mid-30s until I finally started to get clear on a lot of this stuff, 'cause you have to live through it. You can't just philosophize or look into the future or predict, you have to go through some of the stuff to get the tangible experience of what makes it real. And so, the interesting part that I look at is, how quickly can you help someone get conscious about this stuff, become aware of it. Just like most of us are unaware of our heartbeat right now, but when you start to think about your heartbeat, all of a sudden, you can feel it, if you just put your thumb on your risk, you could feel a little pulsing. If you stop and think about other stuff, the heartbeat doesn't stop. It's always there. You're just not thinking about it.


Same thing with the stories, beliefs, and habits. If you put your thumb on it, you can feel the pulse of how they're affecting your life, but as soon as you take your focus away, they're going to keep going whether you want them to or not. It's always there. And so that thought of, can I put my finger on the pulse just long enough to become consciously aware of what it is? Now what's interesting with our heartbeat, most of us, maybe Wim Hof, but most of us can't really control that. It just it is what it is. Wim does it with breathing, he can slow it down or speed it up, and other powerful people can. But most of us, we just kind of experience it. Same thing with those stories, beliefs and habits. Most of us just experience the effects of them, and so for people who haven't taken control or become aware and they don't want to write it, they just want to experience life, they believe that life is not to be written out and planned, life is to be experienced, and the beauty of it is letting it unfold how it does, for those people it's just consciously reflecting back every 30 days and saying, who was I? How was I?


What was that? And how can I experience it even more beautifully in the future in the next 30 days? For people who like to plan, organized, create, design their own future, design where they're going to be and how it's going to be, those people pick up the pen and powerfully create the future. You go, you know what? Here's what my story is going to be over the next 30 days, here's what habits I'm going to stick with, here's what beliefs I'm going to hold about myself in the world and people. And all of a sudden, they get to develop design and walk into their destiny, which is cool 'cause they crafted it.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Oh man, this is so good. I love that advice about just looking at the past 30 days, I think that the superpower in this, both of those are powerful, but the superpower is both. Like every year, when my wife and I do our goals, we first reflect on the accomplishments from the last year, and there'll be stuff that we set a goal for. Of course, you're not going to hit everything, but then there's a lot of surprise things. What were the beautiful surprises? What are the challenges we overcame? When we do that and you see what you're able to do when you get clear on what you want, it creates this... It opens another gear in your mind to know I can create my future is as we go into writing our new goals.


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right. And for some people, identity is a big one, and I'll bring this back to a relationship in a second. But with identity, some people can't envision themselves being who they want to be yet, they haven't felt it, they haven't... It's not real for them. It's just a fluffy thing on paper. And so, one of the fastest ways you can adjust someone's identity is through experience. Like if you took someone who said, "Listen, I'm not a thrill seeker. I'm not an adventurous person, that's just not who I am." Now, if you took them and you would zip-lining, skydiving, bungee jumping over a few weeks, you'd look back and say, "Well, you can say you're not an adventurous person, that could be your narrative all day long, but you're a skydiver. Like you successfully jumped out of a plane and landed on earth with your feet. Like how does that feel?" And all of a sudden, by becoming a skydiver, their whole identity transforms, 'cause now they have a physical reference point based in true life experience that says, I am adventurous. I can do stuff like this. And so, for people as they're evolving someone to say... And I've heard people say, we call them limiting beliefs, but these thoughts that anchor them back. They say, you know, I'm not able to love.


And I'm like, oh, where did that come from? And they anchor back to a moment, 15, 17, 18, 19, 22, 28, whatever, they anchor back to a moment in their life where the narrative and story is wrapped around, something happened to me, and it shut off a piece of my ability to do this in my life any further. We call these past anchors or past triggers. Most of the time in an argument with another human being, you're not getting the present version of them right now in this moment, what you're getting is a reaction to a trigger that was setting off something from the past, something that got them somewhere back here, there was a trigger, a land mine that you accidentally stepped on in this moment, and all of a sudden that past experience just exploded into this moment and they're... I think the phrase is, don't bleed on people who didn't cut you, that's what's happening though. They're starting to gush all that emotion and all that built up tension, anger, frustration, pain, sadness, whatever it is, explodes, just 'cause you accidentally stepped on the land mine that triggered that past experience.


And so, what's interesting, when people become aware of their own land mines, they can go back and do the healing, which un-anchors that and releases it, and I've seen some amazing healing. There's people who can do it through singing, there's people who can do it through dancing, there's people who can do it through body work, like physical adjustments, like a chiropractor. There's people who can do it with pen and paper in a room, there's therapists can do it, counselors can do it, all kinds of people. But it's the ability to look back and say, I probably have a few. I probably got a few, at least one or two, I'm going to go dig around and find it. What's interesting, that experience, that person that says, I can't love 'cause this happened to me, the moment they go do that work, then you got to have a physical experience where you go somewhere, and you consciously choose to love. You choose to flow into another human being. You choose like little like beam shooting, what is it? Cyclops in X-men, like, boom, beams of love just beaming out and you're pouring it into another human being. And you're like, wow, I can choose the love and be safe and protected and guided and honored at the same time. When that unfolds, all of a sudden, you see a human being come back to life. It was like a tree where the flowers were dying, and all of a sudden, the flowers start blooming again.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah, and you could do that in the moment. That's magical, and I've done it. So, I could be in a conflict with my wife, and I'm just seeing her just like pure... Not pure, pure unadulterated of evil, and it's just like there's so much beauty here. And it's often times, again, it's my perception. There is this interesting distinction about whether or not a person is for you or against you, right? Because even in those moments, it's like your team not us, and you're supposed to be team us. And a lot of the time, it's not that somebody's trying to get traded to another team, it's just like you said, somebody stepped on a land mine. I, her or myself stepped on the land mine, that often times has nothing to do with the situation at hand. But for this, and this creates full circle, a lot of these things that we bring into our lives, and whether it's writing our future, or our relationships has a lot to do with alignment, what we're in alignment with.




SHAWN STEVENSON: In that moment, and also getting clear on what do we want to be in life.


JAIREK ROBBINS: Totally. I always break down great relationships to three pieces, alignment, teamwork. So, I'll start with these, and I'll tell you the third. Alignment, meaning vision, values, beliefs, rules. Are they in alignment? Have you consciously become aware of your, on paper, your vision, your values, your beliefs, your rules, have you written them down, become consciously aware of what you are becoming, going towards, believe, the rules? Any time someone's upset, it's 'cause you violated one of the rules. And that the rule is, shouldn't do that. People shouldn't do that. That's a rule. We all have them. Watch the next time you get frustrated with anything anywhere, listen to the rule in your head. The rule would be like, people shouldn't do that, and then just question it. I'm not saying it's wrong or right. I'm just saying, question it. Say, why shouldn't people do that? And what happens is, you'll hear your beliefs that you've created around a rule on how other humans should or shouldn't be living their life, that's what pisses us off. The action of what they did doesn't, the rule we have about them not supposed to be doing that is what actually causes the frustration. And so, vision, values, rules, all of that has to be in alignment. One, we got to be aware of our own. Two, we got to become aware of our partners. Three, we got to co-create a new one.


Here's what's interesting, when people get in a relationship, they often want the other person to come over to their rules, their beliefs, their values, their vision. I've heard it said in great books where it's like, oh, the masculine energy, whether it's man or woman, the masculine energy needs to be a freight train and invite the feminine energy on board. I was like, that sounds cool and all, but why don't we co-create a relationship together instead of saying, I'll create it and you're welcome to come with me if you want to. That sounds kind of selfish. I was like, why don't we co-create this train? Why don't we decide where the tracks are going? Why don't we decide what the rules are on board? And here's the key, when we're on board together, this is the manifesto that we choose to live by. If either of us decide to get off the train, we're our own person. She has her rules, vision values, beliefs. I have my vision, values, rules, beliefs, but when we're on the train together called in relationship, this is what we've both agreed to live by. I went, oh, that's powerful. And then I went to start interviewing and asking couples and saying, how many of you all have done this work? And, I haven't met a whole lot of who have.




JAIREK ROBBINS: And that's part of why that train lands up in disasterville, 'cause the work wasn't done. I mean, you're on board a train with someone, you don't know where it's going, you don't know what the rules are, you don't know what's good or bad, right, or wrong, you don't know what the values are.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Who's driving this thing?


JAIREK ROBBINS: You don't know who's driving or you're both trying to drive. That's a mess, right? That's a relationship people are have. I was like, man, we got to become conscious to that, that's like a weekend workshop. You get together with someone when you go, okay, I'm going to identify all mine, you can identify all yours. We're going to take a third piece of paper and say, this is ours. And we're going to co-create it over this weekend, so that when we choose to be on the train together, we have the outline. The other analogy I use for this, imagine we sit down at a board game, you think we're playing chess, I think we're playing Monopoly. In the beginning, when we're presenting our best self, I'm going to be like, you want to be the thimble, the train, you choose. And you're like ha-ha, very funny, very funny. It's white or black, man, it's black or white. There's no train and thimble, but I'm cool with you. We're cool. We're getting to know each other. I'll let it pass.


I'm like, oh. You're like, okay, roll the dice here. I'm like rolling dice. You're like, There's no dice in this game, but it's cool. We like each other, we're just getting to know each other, we let it pass. After about 15 more moves, we're ready to kill each other. Like stop talking about passing go, who cares? And we start coming up with random stuff to piss each other off, because we never did the alignment. We never started playing the same game with the same rules with the same principles with the same values. And so, getting together, one of the main things is alignment. Can you get all the most important pieces in alignment from the beginning or as soon as you become aware? I've had people message me and be like, dude, we've been married for 30 years and never thought about this, is it too late? Like, no, get in alignment, so the next 30 years are better than the first 30 years. Get on the same train.


Second piece, so we talked about alignment, teamwork. Are all people rowing in the same direction? Teamwork is big, man. I mean, imagine getting in one of those dragon boats with 15 rowers, except for seven of the rowers are rowing forward and the other seven are rowing backwards, and then the person in the front just keeps yelling row, but doesn't give direction on which way or how hard or anything. There's no way you're going to win the race. And so that next piece is teamwork, can we get everyone moving in the same direction or similar direction? Can we get everyone willing to put in the same amount of effort? Can we get everyone choosing to show up and do the work together?


SHAWN STEVENSON: And be clear on their roles.


JAIREK ROBBINS: Yeah, roles and responsibilities. We interviewed a bunch of couples who were much older. This would be interesting for this show, there's two pieces of this I think were interesting that we learned. One, older men, much older, 70s, 80s, I asked them what's the secret being to married 20 years, 30 years, 40 years, 50 years? All of them said the same thing. Drove me nuts. The thing they said was, just get good at saying, "Yes, dear. Whatever you'd like." I was like, that cannot be the true answer. I was like, that feels so weak and that's it, just, yes, whatever you want? And they're like, you'll see, give a time.


And I did research, and the thing that stood out to me is testosterone levels over time. As a lot of guys get older, their testosterone levels tend to drop over long periods of time, like 70s, 80s. Women after menopause, and correct if I'm wrong, this is your show, you know this better than I do. After menopause, women's testosterone tends to rise. And I went, Oh. She becomes the driver. She has that go forth energy, that clear vision of what we're going to do and how we're going to do it with that testosterone driving it and his collapses over time. And I went, that's fascinating, fascinating, 'cause all the old guys said the same thing and it drove me nuts, 'cause I'm a young guy with a lot of testosterones. I'm like, that can't be true, that can't be the secret. And I went, oh, maybe that's natural. Where over time, I mean, I trust women in my life, they tend to be more caring, they tend to... And not more caring, but they tend to just have that innate caring about them, they tend to be strong and powerful and confident, yet nurturing and empathetic. And they'll listen a little bit deeper than most of the guys I know.


And so, in looking at that, I said what's... I don't know what nature's plan is on this one, but what's the benefit of her testosterone rising over time and his starting to fall? I think it might be she'll think more of the whole community and family and make sure things are put in place to better protect the whole, where he's more of a driver where he'll drive an initiative forward or go hunt or make stuff happen. And I don't know the whole story there, but I just thought it was fascinating. That was the most consistent phrase, 70 and 80-year-old men would tell me about what makes a relationship work. Now, the other thing we learned was there was a couple who'd been together, they had been married before, they had been divorced before, and they finally figured out how to really make it work for themselves. And they said... Well, you said one of the most important things is putting together an org chart for your family, roles, and responsibilities, who's in charge of what. 'Cause there's a lot of assumptions. Well, you're the mom, you should be in charge of that. I'm the dad I should be in charge of this.


People assume things, which means if you did that in the workplace, the ball would get dropped, a project wouldn't get done, people would be like, "Hey, what happened to IT departments?" I don't know, I thought you were in charge of that. Just gone. And so, in a family, it doesn't feel very sexy, warm, fun. It doesn't feel very romantic, but it's amazing when there's clarity on it, how much smoother everything goes. And you'll find stuff that you want to do, that you get to do, you don't find stuff you don't want to do that, you get to do. And then you'll find stuff that you can, at different times, trade with each other. And say, "Hey, I know you don't love to do that, I have space, I will do that for you," and that's a gift you can give your teammate. You can say, "Hey, I got you on this time. I got you on that piece right there, I know you're willing to do it, but you don't love to do it, I'll take it for you when I can." And it's a way you can give gifts to each other constantly. So, alignment, teamwork, third part's communication. There's so much that's been done in this category, and it's one of the fastest ways to screw up a relationship, just miscommunication. I've learned the number one rule, just check how much sleep the other person is getting. You want to get a real bad fight? Just don't get good sleep for a few nights in a row, horrible blow-up will happen over time.


So, number one, sleep. Are they their best selves, sleep, exercise, nutrition? Of those are peaking, they're absolutely at their prime and there's still tension, then we go into, ah do they feel like they are enough, do they feel like they have enough, do they feel like they're loved enough? Which with the three buckets aren't full right now, 'cause I've yet to meet a person that feels like I am enough, I have enough, I'm loved enough, and then they attack another human, or they're mean, or they're defensive, or they're aggressive. I've never met one. When someone feels total abundance, I have enough to live life I want to live, I am enough as a human being, I am who I am, and I believe I am enough to be who I want to be, and I'm loved enough, love is just flowing through me and everything that I do and all that I am, those people just want to help other people and pour over into other humans. But the moment someone doesn't feel like they're enough, they're going to attack someone else to try to not feel less than. The moment someone doesn't feel loved enough, again, they're going to be all peculiar in their behaviors because they don't feel that love internally, it's not abundant, therefore they're going to try to get it from somewhere else. And have enough.


Again, if someone feels like they don't have enough to live the life they want to live, which is a big thing right now with money, if people don't feel like they have enough, they get real peculiar in their behaviors quickly. And so, communication first, check in. Where is this person that at? Do they feel like they have enough, they're loved enough, and they are enough? Did they get enough sleep, have they eaten, have they worked out, they're their best self? Okay, good. Now, there's two pieces of communication that have been unbelievably helpful from two different sources, one comes from Imago therapy, and it's a way to listen, it's a way to listen. There's four steps: Number one, listen. And after they're done talking, you're going to repeat back what you heard, you're going to acknowledge what they heard, and then you're going to empathize. So, one is listen. Two is repeat back what you heard. The third part is you're going to acknowledge it, "I can see that," and then you're going to empathize, "Man, that must feel like this." I was like, there's four steps in listening? I was have trouble just listening, especially if my wife accidentally stepped on a land mine and my brain's like, "That's not true. I need to tell you my side of the story." I stopped doing step one, which was just listen.


And so, there's four steps to listening, now there's three steps in sharing. This was the other part. I forget who this one comes from, I think John Julie Gottman, three steps in sharing. When you did X, that made me feel Y and what I need is Z. So specifically, when your feelings are hurt, when the rage monster is boiling, when you can't see straight. You're about to turn into the hulk. I feel blank and you got to use an emotion. I got called out when I was in my level one course with the Gottman Group, 'cause I said, "I feel curious." And the guy looked at me and he's like, "Curious is not a feeling. Tell me how you feel? A feeling, an emotion." I was like, "Curiosity could be emotion." He's like, "No, it's not, keep trying." I said, "What do I feel?" And I said, "I feel lost." He goes, "Closer." It's like, "What's the feeling? I feel uncertain." He goes, "There you go." And then he goes, "I feel uncertain right now." And he goes, "Why, what happened?" And I said, "I feel uncertain. When you did this, it made me feel uncertain or I chose to feel uncertain when you did this, and what I really need is a little bit more information right now."


And he went, he hit the other side, "It sounds like you're feeling uncertain." He goes, "Yeah, I can totally get why you might feel uncertain right now, it's a lot of information you're learning. Man, feeling uncertain probably doesn't feel very good. I'd feel kind of uneasy too, if I was in that position. How can I help?" I was like, "Wow." Now, what's interesting, I took this home, I printed out how to say it, how to listen, I hand it to my wife. She says, "What do you expect me to be, a freaking robot?" She's like, "We got to communicate, we can't just read scripts." And I started laughing, I'm like, "Well, that's the four stages of learning anything. In the beginning, you have to give yourself permission to be horrible at it, 'cause you've never done it before." And so, be horrible at it long enough that you become okay, be okay at it long enough that you become really good and be good at it long enough that you become great. And so, if you give yourself permission to re-learn something from the place where you just straight up suck at it, you're going to be horrible at it long enough until you'd be great, that's the promise I made to my wife.


In our relationship, if you give me the space, I will be horrible at learning these tools long enough and consistently enough that eventually I'll be pretty good at it, and eventually I'll be great, and eventually I'll master these things. But I'm willing to be a disaster for her.


SHAWN STEVENSON: It becomes second nature, as you know. But man, I love that so much because I've had those same thoughts like, "Isn't this kind of robotic? Isn't this taken away from the present moment?" I'm learning something that is going to help the most important relationship in my life. You said there's something so powerful in that formula, and it made me feel like versus, and your intention was, right? Because it's very different, the way that I pick it up, that I feel versus what your attention was.


JAIREK ROBBINS: One buffer I got called on, 'cause I did the same thing you just did, "It made me feel like... " Teacher of the class told me that's manipulation. Get rid of the word like and get to the real feeling, 'cause it's an expression of human spirit. It's the expression of true feeling.


SHAWN STEVENSON: And it matters.


JAIREK ROBBINS: It does matter, it makes a difference 'cause when someone’s says, "It makes me feel like you don't care." Now I'm manipulating 'cause I'm trying to craft my side of the story by using it, but then adjusting it with a buffer word called 'like' versus if I said, "It makes me feel less then." That's a big, bold, courageous statement to have to make out loud, so most of us try to skip the courage and use a little bit of a manipulative move around this tool versus get to the real tool. But I'd recommend people go take the courses, go read the books. You're hearing a highlight reel here where I'm giving you the exact steps but go sign up for the Gottman course and go learn it over three days with them, so you actually know why it works and how it works and how to use it right. Go read the books on Imago therapy. I spent five years before I met my wife learning all this stuff. And then her and I have spent almost the last 11 years together practicing this stuff, and we were horrible in the beginning, horrible. But we've sucked at it for 11 years to the point that now we're really good.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Isn't it crazy that the things that are so important, we don't invest in? It's just like we literally... Most of us don't know what a healthy relationship looks like, how it works. Oftentimes we don't have specific examples, and we're just figuring stuff out on the job. And that's okay, but it starts with coming together. Like you said, are we even playing the same game? Are we choosing to get on this train together and all these pieces? But also, I want to mention, in that piece, we believe that our feelings are reality as well, right? So, this made me feel versus that's just my perspective, versus what's actually happening in the room. So, for example, when I mentioned, I could see my like you're evil, but then to be able to ask questions, for example. You say... You've interwoven so many powerful insights that are so real, but they take work because in the moment, I don't want to ask a question because I can ask myself, "Is she really evil? Just earlier today, you said she's the best human ever born." So, is it true, right? So that's one of those questions that I've found to be very valuable, just like, is it true, is it true, is it true?


And just drilling down. We've got a quick break coming up, we'll be right back. Few people know that regularly drinking coffee has been shown to help prevent cognitive decline and reduce the risk of developing Alzheimer's and Parkinson's Disease. This attribute referenced in the Journal of Practical Neurology is yet another reason why intelligent coffee consumption makes the list of best neuro-nutritious beverages. Another study featured in the journal Psychopharmacology uncovered that drinking coffee has some remarkable benefits on mental performance. The research has found that intelligent coffee intake leads to improvements in alertness, improved reaction times and enhanced performance on cognitive vigilance tasks and tasks that involve deep concentration. Now, why am I stressing intelligent coffee intake? This means acknowledging the true U-shaped curve of benefits and not going ham on caffeine.


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I got to mention this too, it's so simple, Jerry, this is what I love about it. Are we playing the same game, teamwork and communication. You said the most important thing that is simply not a part of most even courses and books about communication, are they in a physiological healthy state? Because if you check back into your mental database, what is the time of day when you have most of your fights?


JAIREK ROBBINS: At night when you're tired.


SHAWN STEVENSON: It's probably late, when you're tired the whole day, you probably got it in your mind I need to get some sleep. I got whatever going on in the morning. And you're feeling like you're just stacking conditions against you and to be able to not just for yourself, but for the other person to remember. And this is something that's taken some work because you just want to handle your sh*t right in that moment, but just to be like, "Okay, I see that she's irritated or whatever the case might be." How did she sleep last night? To do the check-in for myself, has she been stressed today? Did she eat? Right? Because I can see it, both of us now we know when the other person needs to eat something. And even with that though, we might throw a little jab in, like your ass to eat something. You know what I mean? I can throw it in, but then I know that that's the thing and just let me just put this on pause. It's not that important. Make sure she gets something in her system and all of a sudden, she is all kind cuddly, right?


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right. My wife and I did a constant blood sugar monitor just to see how life affects our blood sugar. So, waking up, running, working out, eating, what we eat, when we eat, what combination of stuff we eat and what causes our blood sugar and how is it moving throughout the day. And when we were doing that, every Sunday morning we had a ritual, we would wake up, we'd lie bed together, and we would say, "What were your love lessons from this week?" And every week we reviewed, what were your love lessons? What did we learn about love this week? 'Cause if you're constantly learning about it and sharing about it and know you have a pop quiz every week, you're going to be looking for love lessons. If you're looking for love, you're going to find love. And so, we were looking for love every week. And we'd say, "What was your love lessons?" One Sunday, Miami Beach, 30th floor apartment, Ocean View everywhere. We're lying in bed, talking. And my wife likes to listen to audio books in 2.5 speed.




JAIREK ROBBINS: Sometimes she starts talking in 2.5 speed. My brain doesn't have the superpower to comprehend the words at 2.5 speed, especially on Sunday morning before I've worked out. So, she started talking faster and faster and faster. And I was like, "Oh my gosh, she's really going." And I had an idea, I went, I need to know what her blood sugar is doing right now. Ran to the other room, grabbed the monitor, ran back and I tried to scan it and she whacked my hand. She's like, "Get away from me, what are you trying to do?" She is like, "You're just trying to get me to shut up." I'm like, "No, I'm not, I need to know what's going on in your blood sugar," and I finally scanned it, it beeped and I'm like, "I got it." And I checked, her blood sugar was just falling, falling, falling, falling, falling. I said, "Explain to me how you feel right now." She said, "I feel like my gas tank is running out of fuel and I'm trying to get all my words out before I'm completely empty." I went, "One second," and I ran to the kitchen, and I grabbed the banana or something. I literally like Gorilla style, ripped it in half, came back and was like, "Come here." She's like, "No." And I was like, "Eat it." And I got her to take a couple of bites, I scanned it again in 30 seconds, and it started to come back up.


Now, all over sudden she starts talking slower. I went, "I just learned something," and this is like my vault as a husband. I just learned an important thing about my wife. When I hear that she's starting to talk super-fast, it means usually her blood sugar is falling and I need to feed her. I went, "I just become aware of a signal of how I can better take care of the human I love." I went, what else can I learn about her? What else can I learn about how she thinks, how she processes, how she experiences life to where I know what to do under a situation like that? 'Cause before my brain would explode and I'm like, why is she talking so fast, I just don't get it and I can't keep up. Versus my wife's hungry, I can hear it in the speed in which she's talking. Let me go grab her something to eat.


SHAWN STEVENSON: That's powerful. All of this stuff is like a cheat code for reality. It's like a up, up, down, down, left, right kick.


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right.


SHAWN STEVENSON: You're changing... You're unlocking a special board or a special power. It's just like, the more that you do it, again, it just becomes automatic. And...


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right. My friend as Alice Armstrong wrote a book called 'Women: Unlock the Mystery'. I was like, "Oh, that's what it is."


SHAWN STEVENSON: That's a big promise, but...


JAIREK ROBBINS: But I listened to it, and it was filled with stuff like that. Where it's like I heard something and I paused and went, "Ah. That makes so much sense." And I just understood it a whole another level. She said something that was fascinating. And she's very traditional in men and women. I know that's a big topic nowadays. People are confused about and trying to redefine and figure out. But she says for a woman... In her words, not mine. In a woman, feelings are a layer that live between her organs and her skin. It's another layer.


JAIREK ROBBINS: So, think of layers of rocks. Like how the Earth was formed, and you see all these layers. So, there's like a layer called feelings that live between the organs and the skin in a woman. So, when her feelings are hurt her entire being hurts. The whole layer hurts. And she says for men, most of us, our feelings live somewhere right here. So, when you see a man...


SHAWN STEVENSON: Right here, you were pointing at your throat.


JAIREK ROBBINS: Right here...


SHAWN STEVENSON: Your throat area.


JAIREK ROBBINS: Like the throat area. So, when you see a man with his feelings hurt, oftentimes you'll see him get choked up. You'll see him kind of tighten and contract right in here. Where when a woman's feelings are hurt it's like her whole being is hurt from head to toe. And I went, "Oh, that's interesting." In that program, she literally gave a step-by-step formula of how to reboot a woman's feelings.


And I was like, "What?" What kind of sorcery is this woman sharing? And she said, there's a statement. Any person can do it, but if a man in proximity... It could be your brother, sister, cousin, aunt... Whatever. It doesn't have to be your husband or a significant other or a wife. But if you wanted to give someone a gift. Hold space. So set the big deep breath. Total presence. Hold their hands, look her deep in the eye and say, "I'm sorry I hurt your feelings." I'm sorry I hurt your feelings. Not, I'm sorry your feelings are hurt. That's not taking responsibility. Not, "Man, that's really jacked up. You're all messed up over there, huh?" That's not doing it. Like I'm sorry I hurt your feelings. Even if you weren't the one who did it. It doesn't matter.


SHAWN STEVENSON: So, you're talking about some ninja level... Master level...


JAIREK ROBBINS: You're about to hit the reset switch on the whole feelings that exist from head to toe, the layer between the organs and the skin. What's interesting, if you did this in a public setting, when it lands, you'll hear a gasp. Ahh... She'll gasp. Any woman within listening proximity will gasp. Ahh. When one resets, you'll reset a bunch if they're in the room with each other.


This is really wild. I've tested it. It's true. I'm sorry I hurt your feelings. Total presence. It's like literally pressing the reset button. It's amazing. What comes after that is the... Ahh. And if you reset something, all the stuff that clogged it up will have to come out. So, you will unleash all the things that hurt her feelings, all of them. These might date back to...


SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah, the land mine triggers.


JAIREK ROBBINS: A long time ago. Something you did without knowing you did it, without realizing you did it, without knowing her feelings were hurt way back then, 'cause she never told you. But all of a sudden, "I'm sorry, I hurt your feelings." This one time when you did that and this and this and this and this and this and this, like they'll just start flowing. Think of a river where it's like, whooo. You just broke the dam and let all of it out. And all of a sudden when it's done, you'll know it's done, usually there's a few tears involved.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Alright. This is enough because...


JAIREK ROBBINS: And then she'll lean in for a hug.


SHAWN STEVENSON: It just connected right there because I've experienced this and didn't realize it many times. Where I apologize and then I get flooded with all this stuff. And I'm like literally before... There's been times where I'd be like, "Damn, I just apologized why you just... " You know what mean?


JAIREK ROBBINS: Why you hit me with everything now?


SHAWN STEVENSON: And then I... But... Because again, trial and success, I realize like, okay, even when those things happen, I just let them happen. Because what did I apologize for? I didn't apologize to not make progress. And also, I think this is quite possibly the most important ingredient in that, which is even when it might not be your fault to have the audacity to put your relationship above your perspective or a perception of what's happening, and just like put the value of your relationship... Not to say that you're not important, but often times we blow things out of a proportion.


A lot of times, especially in loving healthy relationships, we get into it about the dumbest things. And sometimes it can be a matter of trying to address a need. Maybe they're wanting attention. Maybe you feel like you need something that you're not getting. Whatever the case might be. So, we'll create conflicts or nit-pick things or whatever the case might be. And also, you mentioned that story about the blood sugar was incredible. Researchers at the Ohio State University did a study looking at blood sugar and how people perceived their significant other when in conflict. Right?


And so, each night they would actually have the test participants... They check their blood sugar and then they also use a doll, to put pins in the doll based on how irritated they are with their partner. And basically, when their blood sugar was abnormal they would put far more pins into that doll... And they would have more pissosity. They'd be more pissed off, more irritated. But here's the big takeaway from the study, after the researchers looked at all the data, they found that when folks had an abnormal blood sugar, not only did they have more conflicts with their significant other, they were far less likely to resolve their relationship conflicts. And so, you're trying... You're fighting, you're hitting yourself against the wall, trying to resolve a conflict that biologically, your biology is fighting against the situation.


And it takes a little bit of miracle, a little sprinkle of some miracle to find common ground when you're biologically not well. And so, this is a big part of what we're dealing with as a society today. We're largely... We are the most unhealthy society in documented human history. 130 million Americans have diabetes or pre-diabetes. Right now, we're talking about abnormal blood sugar being a culprit behind relationship conflicts. So, we're wondering why are people not being compassionate or being able to perspective take?


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Or be able to analyze their own ideas and maybe consider, "Maybe... Hey, I don't know everything."


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right.


SHAWN STEVENSON: It's because we've got to get our citizens physically healthy and... But it starts with you and your family.


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's right. That's right. I measure a bunch of my client... We were laughing when we first started. I have all these trackers I use. I measure a bunch of my clients just to get the baseline trend of where they're at. I use WHOOP a ton with them. And one thing I noticed is the majority of the people I work with are running oftentimes, in the beginning, they're running on a sleep deficit. Meaning every night, they're getting an hour or more less than what they needed.


And so over a week, that's only seven hours less than you needed. Over a month it starts stacking. Over a year, it starts stacking. And all of a sudden, the deficit is getting bigger, and bigger, and bigger, and bigger, and bigger. And if you look at the trends and patterns and relationship and communication, they get harder and harder, or worse and worse and worse over time. And so, the number one thing I've done with people when they first come to me is like, "Dude, I just need you to get seven and a half to eight hours of high-quality sleep. 20% REM, 20% deep every night for the next 30 nights, and then we'll see how you're doing.


And what's funny is, one, a lot of people struggle with just doing that, but when they do it, they come back and a huge majority of all the stuff they were dealing with that were problems and aches and pains and all this stuff in their life, almost all of them vanish within 30 days, and all they do is correct their sleep. You know this, I learned it from you.


SHAWN STEVENSON: That's amazing, man. It's so powerful. These are just simple biological inputs. And by the way, for folks, the continuous glucose monitor, my wife just got another one. It actually was just delivered this week. Go to That's


Levels is really leading the charge in this field with their data points, but also, they've got... I think 150,000 people on a waiting list to get access. They're letting people in a little bit at a time but use that link and you can skip the line. Yeah, so it's a great opportunity with those guys. For me, utilizing the continuous glucose monitor, I'm not as affected by food, whether it's... Whatever micronutrient ratio it is as I am by psychological stress would tinker with my blood sugar more so than even the food that I'm eating.


So, if I'm running hard and I've got this thing and I'm jumping from task to task, that's for me more likely. Versus my wife, she's task master. All the tabs on the computer, it gives me anxiety, just look at... I'm not an easily anxiety-triggered person, but just using her computer and seeing all those tabs, it's just like how... How are you operating? She's like, "Oh, it was just because... "


So, her brain... Her nervous system handles that differently. But for her, some dietary inputs can derange her blood sugar a little bit more. So, finding those little things out for ourselves. Man, it's so... It's pretty cool. So again, that's And I've got to ask you about this as well. I want to ask you about relationship personality types. I heard you do a piece on givers, takers and traders. Let's talk a little bit about that.


JAIREK ROBBINS: I'll give you two types of personality types. So, there's... So, Adam Grant wrote an amazing book on givers, takers and traders. People who come to give, people who come to trade, people who come to get... I'll give you the foundational summary. If you go to a relationship to get you will only stay as long as you can continue to get whatever you're trying to get. The moment it runs dry, you'll go to somewhere else to find it. And so, for people who, for some reason, relationships won't last, often times it's 'cause they're going there to get something. They're trying to get attention. They're trying to get approval. They're trying to get loved. They're trying to get something.


Instead of saying, "Ah, I'm going to find my greatest talents, my greatest skills, my greatest attributes, my greatest all of who I am, and I'm going to find somewhere that I love to go share those with this person." And the reason why I want the relationship is to share the greatest gifts of who I am with this other human. Hopefully, you find a human who values receiving those gifts. And the gifts that that human most wants to share are the gifts you dream about receiving. Talk about a relationship. The gifts that person A most wants to give is the gifts that person B dreams about receiving.


And the gifts that person B most wants to give are the gifts that person A dreams about receiving. And they both love the process of giving the gift. Talk about a flourishing relationship that goes somewhere. Versus when two people are there to get, it doesn't work. When one person is there to get and one person is there to trade, that's a mess. That turns into some messy stuff.


Because what happens is that one person gives the other person doesn't give back... The person gives, gets nothing back... A trader, if you don't trade with them and you just take from them, they will make it their mission to end you. I'm thinking like rabbits and boiling pots... Creepy stuff. Like... End you.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Like those dolls with the pins... But like...


JAIREK ROBBINS: Yeah. Crazy stuff... If you have ever been in a relationship and the other person went way overboard on the reaction, if it didn't work out, you might have been in a place where you were taking something they were trading. And when you took, and they traded, and you didn't trade back they made it their mission... They activated the psycho level of response.


That's just how those personalities match. Adam says, when a giver and a trader get together, it goes great, 'cause the giver gives the trader feels obligated, they give back and they just go all the way up. When two givers get together... Oh... It goes to the moon a hundred times over. And so, there's that side. The other side of this... My friend Allison gave me this. She said... There's kind four reasons why people choose to be in a relationship. And it goes along with relationship personality types.


One is they're looking for a... Some type of support; mental, emotional, physical. They either want to support the other person or they want to be supported in some way by the other person. They're seeking some type of support or to be the support. Two, they're looking for companionship, meaning they want to do things together with the other human. And I mean everything.


I'm a companionship person, and my wife will tease me sometimes. She's like, "You like hanging out with me?" I was like, "I went and met as many of the other seven billion people out there on earth, and I chose you 'cause I want to do everything with you." I want to go on a walk together. I want to go adventure together. I want to learn things together... Like I want to sign up for this OPM program, Owners Presidents, and Management course at Harvard Business. And I'm like, "I got to save up more money so that my wife and I can do it together."


I want to do everything together. That's one of my love languages. That's my peace. Now, that's companionship model. So, there's support model, companionship model. The third one she talked about was the legacy. It's like when you meet a couple that they don't have anything in common. If you talk to them separately, they kind of don't even really like each other. They tolerate each other, but they're not like in love. They're just like, "Oh yeah, it's them." But they're together for some reason. And when you dig around for the reason of like, "Why are these two people even together?" And you find out, it's like... Think of medieval days. The Princess of such and such married the prince of such and such, so that the two kingdoms can further the legacy. They don't know each other, like each other, or anything... They did it because of legacy. They need the countries to continue in peace kind of stuff.


There's people still today who choose relationships like that. Different pockets of the country for different reasons, but they're doing it not because they're in love and not because of the relationship, they're doing it because of some factor they believe will necessarily continue. I've met people... I'll keep their privacy to them. But I met them... They live on the other side of the world. They were together, he was very successful, she was very successful. They got together, they had kids. And I talked to him, and he was a companionship model. He's like, "I want to do everything with my wife." I talked to her; she was a legacy model. She's like, "I'm going to go do my yoga retreat in Bali." And he's like, "I'll go with you." She's like, "No, I'm going to go there and relax by myself, thank you." And he was devastated 'cause he wanted to do everything together, she wanted to make sure the kids had a great life, and that's all she was concerned about.


Now, people might be judgmental on that and be like, "Oh, she was in it for the wrong reasons." Like no, she was in it for her reasons, and he was in it for his. But they weren't aware that people have different reasons, and there's actually four or five different reasons people could have. So, companionship, legacy, support. I'm trying to remember what the other one was off the top of my head... Oh growth. Growth. I choose a person because they make me grow. Or I choose a person 'cause I can help make them grow. But the moment they're not growing, it's like, "Ah, I don't know if the relationship calls to me anymore, 'cause I'm not growing. I need to go find a relationship where I can grow." I was like, "Oof." and so I look at why they end, why they start, what was someone really seeking.


Those four... There's five, but those four really helped me decode a lot of why things were happening. 'Cause I'd sit down with people. And again, the whole alignment piece. If you spend a weekend with someone being like, "Hey, which one are you? Which one am I?" Now, a lot of times, my friend Allison Armstrong says people ask her when they find those out and go, "Oh my gosh, if we're not the same one will it ever work? We've been married for 30 years. Does this mean it's over?" No, no, just become aware that's what they need and that's what you need, and you can choose even if you're not the same one, you can choose to go, oh, they need more companionship. I need more support. What does support look like to me? Here's the list. What does companionship look like to them? Here's the list. Cool, now we're going to give each other that the a gift of doing the one that helps the other side, so you can always make it work if you want to. That's a choice.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Facts. Facts And I would imagine that we have... We're not necessarily going to be 100%, there's going to be some different percentages of some of those things.




SHAWN STEVENSON: 'Cause I know for me, that...


JAIREK ROBBINS: And at different stages of life.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Exactly. Right. It can evolve...


JAIREK ROBBINS: At each stage of life you might evolve, what was more important to you in at each stage, how you evolved as a human.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah. It's so empowering for yourself, because for me, as soon as you say growth, I'm like, that's it right there. And even if I'm not aware of that and I'm faced with... Because if you're just in the fluffy version of growth, you just think it's all like they're just helping me to be a better person, whatever. Versus like they're going to challenge you and help to bring out those qualities. It's not just going to happen because it was an end of a rainbow or something like that. And so, for me, I even met... When I met my wife, I was so consumed with just being better, just being a better human being, being the best, I can, to be of better service. She was also somebody that I could serve and express love that I had withheld so long, but also for me, and she knows this too, I was constantly pushing boundaries. And it wasn't until she really understood that my driving force was growth that everything started to kind of meld in a really special way. And so, with that said, you mentioned something before we got started because we all have... We all have so much capacity, so much brilliance.


The human mind itself is just limitless. We're always broadcasting things as well, like if we're just literally just talking about just getting into a biological level, all of our cells are just teaming with these little antennas that are receiving signals from the environment and changing which proteins are getting... I can go on and on down the rabbit hole. The bottom line is, we're always attuned to broadcast and frequency of our environment if we're looking at quantum dynamics. So there's a frequency of the world around us, and also we have our frequency of our bodies, even our different organs have a different frequency that they're emitting. My heart is going to be different from what's happening with my liver, but there's harmony if you're in a good state of health. The reason I'm bringing this up is you mentioned that some people have the ability to literally shift the energy in a room that they come into. And you got the chance to see it happen with one person specifically. So, let's talk a little bit about that. Because you mentioned The Matrix when you told me about it.


JAIREK ROBBINS: So, I was telling you a story in I think it was 1996, the NBA finals. It was the jazz and the bulls. I hope I got the year right. And I had a chance to go with my dad to one of the Finals games. We had flown in. It was in Chicago. I think it was a Game 6. Michael Jordan was supposed to win that night, so we wanted to be there to experience it. And fast forward, he missed the game-winning shot, which is never fun when you're at your home court and you kind of miss the shot thing, and it was interesting. He wasn't in the best mood and he just... He was frustrated, they just lost the game, and it was supposed to be game winner. They had everything set up that night of them winning, all the things around town, everything was ready to go and just... You missed the shot, which was rare, but it happens. And so afterwards we had a chance to go into the tunnel and wait just to say hi to him very briefly as he was kind of heading in this way after the game out back home. And so, we were waiting in the tunnel, and you could look around and see the energy of the people, and it was kind of nervous and relaxed and just people after a game saying hey and talking to each other and stuff like that.


And then all of a sudden, I said, it's kind of like Neo in the Matrix where when he finds out he can bend reality, how the walls bend, all of a sudden you could see the energy of the room bending, moving. Or humans like popcorn, where the energy was just turning on in people because... And I didn't see it was him, I just saw the energy started to change in that side of the room. And then people over here started to kind of energize, and then people over here started the energize, and people over here started the energize, and then I was like, "Oh, shoot. It's him." And as he moved through the room, the energy kind of popped like popcorn in the different people who started to notice he was there moving into the room. And I noticed that. And it was one of the first times in my life, I was like, "Wow. He kind of bended the energy of the room as he moved through it, like that's interesting." And the piece that I said to you was, I don't know if it's some magic superpower he had inside of himself that as he walked through the room, it was him doing that, or was it the perception people had in their mind of who they thought him to be that was causing them to experience the bend in reality as he moved through it and for them to show up.


Jim Carrey said something interesting. He said the cool part about being super famous and the way he's well-known all over the world is when people meet him, they present their best self. Meaning they energize all the way up and then present the best version of themselves to him when they see him. And I went, wow, I wonder if that has to do with him or I wonder if that has to do with the perception of who they think he is? And I think it's a combination of both. I think it's a combination of who that person has decided to be in the world, and these people have produced excellence in their craft, they really have. Jim Carrey produced excellence in his craft of being funny and acting and being that kind of guy. Michael Jordan produced excellence in his craft, he wasn't always the most friendly human in the world according to all the footage, but he produced excellence on the court. He was one of the best in the world at what he did. And so, when people experienced it, it caused them to present their absolute best to him, which was amazing. And so, I always look at that and I think, wow. How do we seek excellence in whatever it is that we're deciding to be, so that we can cause that leveling up of humans around us? Can we be the type of family person, or can we be the type of human being that just cares or can we...


Can we be the type of person who learns at an insane level? What can we do with total and complete excellence, so that when we walk through a room people decide to present their absolute best to us? Because they're honoring the dedication to the craft that's been there. Side topic for right now, I think with what's going on in the world, so much chaos, so much uncertainty. I just saw an article that one of the number one concerns in America right now is people concerned about being able to buy groceries in the near future, there's some real concern going on. I think something that's given me immense certainty at any stage in of my life when I've done really well in business, when I had nothing... I was trying to figure out how I was going to pay rent 'cause I had credit card bills and stuff stacked up and not enough money. I had more bills than money at that point. And so in between all of those, something I learned a long time ago from the beginning was what they used to do way back in history, which was you honed a craft. It was called, what's your craft. And you went and found a very specific thing. Oftentimes, you found a mentor. Oftentimes, you became an understudy or... I'm trying to think of...




JAIREK ROBBINS: An apprentice. You became an apprentice of someone who had mastered a craft, so that they can teach you how to master the craft yourself, and the craft was a basic way that you brought value to society. And when you had mastered a craft, you could go anywhere in the world and take the mastery of that craft with you and provide valuable additions to the local society you belong to, which means you could trade for food, you could trade for a place to stay, you could trade for a life to take care of the ones you love. Somewhere in my mind, around 16 years old, I said, "Okay, what are the crafts or skills I'm going to master that would be relevant anywhere in the world, in any village, in any situation?" That if I had these tools, I can go anywhere and have the ability to know you could take me to a place I've never been, with people I've never met, in a place I don't speak the language, and within a short period of time, I.e. Five to seven days, I could trade for food, trade for a place to live, trade for a lifestyle and trade to be able to take care of the ones I love.


And what's interesting is when you master skills like that with that intention, where the economy goes doesn't make a difference, 'cause you know if all else failed, you can go anywhere in the world and within a short period of time add enough value that you could take care of the ones you love and have a great life. And so, in times like this I go back to the basics of have people chose to master a craft, anything? I mean, you can master the listening as your craft, you could master talking as your craft, you could master book writing, you could master cupcake making. It doesn't matter, find your craft. But if you chose to master a specific craft, you can look at places in the world and say, where would this be valuable? And I could at any moment relocate if I had to which many people have over the years through wars and situations in the world, they've had to relocate. But find your craft to give yourself the courage and the confidence that no matter where I go, I'll find a way to have a great life.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Man, I think everybody could see now why you stepped in to run things at Success Magazine, one of the most prestigious magazines in the world. And you've really put your essence into this already. You got Shaq for the first... Is this the first one that you are in charge of everything? Is this the first one?


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's the first one I've been a part of.


SHAWN STEVENSON: You got Shaq right of the gate. Shaq Diesel. Big daddy Shaq, right out the gate man, that's amazing.


JAIREK ROBBINS: Yeah. And it's neat, I can't say that I'm fully in charge. We have an unbelievable Editor-in-Chief who's in there, her name is CeCe, and she makes the magazine happen. I get to help with the vision and where we're going and how we're doing, but she's the magic maker when it comes to the magazine. And we're learning how to work together, we're learning how to navigate this, and we're learning how to bring the messages to the world that the world needs most right now. I think what's so interesting with success is it's such a broad term and it's such a big statement, but it's a neat opportunity to say, hey, how do we help everyone level up? How do we help everyone live their best life? How do we help everyone grow a bigger business? How do we help everyone cultivate deeper community and relationships? And if we can bring those through the messages in the magazine, the people. We're constantly at a freemium, basically, giving people tools to support them in their growth and in their journey. I think that's one of the greatest opportunities with Success.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah, man, so powerful. And I'm just... It's so cool to see what you're creating, and you made that decision, you pointed your attention here and to see it manifest, and I know you got some big things in store as well, so can you let folks know where they can pick up Success magazine if they don't know already, and also where they can follow you and just be able to get more into your universe?


JAIREK ROBBINS: Totally, man. I mean, go to It's one of the most epic URLS I know out there. It's, straight at it. If you want to buy the magazine online, you go to It'll take you to our online store and you can buy a copy. You can buy them most all bookstores in the airports, Barnes and Noble, anywhere worldwide. I have friends in Dubai who send me pictures every month when the magazine stocks on the shelf and in the major mall. They'll go take pictures with it. And they'll be like, "Oh, that's you." And I always laugh. I'm like, man, we have distribution worldwide, which is really cool that any time we put out a new issue, it literally circumnavigates the globe, and we have the opportunity to reach people when they need it most with those messages. As far as finding me, Instagram is kind of the place that I play most often, Instagram and LinkedIn. So just find me at Jairek Robbins on Instagram. I'm usually hanging out there chatting with people.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Let's go, my guy. I love talking with you, man. I love just sitting here and listening to you, and it's not just the fact that you've invested so much into your education and service to other people, it's that you're taking these concepts and you're making them so approachable like, ah, oh. It's just so tangible and I can touch it and I can apply it right now. That's a special teacher, that's a sign of a really special teacher, because Einstein has this quote that things should be as simple as possible, but no simpler. Right?


JAIREK ROBBINS: That's true.


SHAWN STEVENSON: And you do that with ease and grace, man. And I appreciate you so much for hanging out with us.


JAIREK ROBBINS: Well, thank you for having me back.


SHAWN STEVENSON: Okay, my pleasure. Can't wait 'til next time. Jairek Robbins, everybody. Thank you so much for tuning in to the show today. I hope you got a lot of value out of this. If you did, please share it out with your friends and family on social media. You can tag me, I'm @shawnmodel and tag Jairek as well @jairekrobbins and take a screenshot of this episode and share it out. It really does mean a lot to help spread the word, spread the goodness. And of course, you could send this directly from the podcast app that you're listening on. And when I tell you we've got some epic guests coming up and some powerful masterclasses that you're not going to want to miss, I really, really mean it. So, make sure to stay tuned. Take care, have an amazing day, and I'll talk with you soon.


And for more after the this show, make sure to head over to, that's where you can find all of the show notes, you can could find transcriptions, videos for each episode. And if you got a comment, you can leave me a comment there as well. And please make sure to head over to iTunes and leave us a rating to let everybody know that the this show is awesome, and I appreciate that so much. And take care, I promise to keep giving you more powerful, empowering, great content to help you transform your life. Thanks for tuning in.

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