SHAWN STEVENSON: When it comes to real health and fitness, it's about far more than diet and exercise. There was a time when I was obsessed with diet and exercise, and I thought it was the end all be all. But if you've been paying attention to the health and wellness space for any time you've seen that this universe has expanded so much. But here's the thing. It is still based in simple principles. It's still based in simplicity, but oftentimes because of the way that our culture is currently constructed, we're not paying attention to these big movers, those big dominoes that knock over all these other wonderful benefits that bring forth the health and wellness that we truly want.

Diet and exercise are really a result of some of these bigger movers, and today we're going to be talking about just that. On this episode, we're gonna be covering the shocking impact that being around other people can have on your microbiome. We're gonna be covering the value of community and helping us through different stages of life. We're gonna talk about how sitting down and eating at a table impacts your health. We're gonna cover which hormone has been found to be an antidote for stress, and we're also going to break down top two most important things for you to do right now to prioritize for truly great health. This conversation took place right here at the Model Health Show Studios, but it was a unique experience because it was a friend of mine who is a superstar in the health and wellness space who asked if she could interview me for her amazing new show called Save Yourself with Dr. Amy Shah.

Now, Dr. Shah is a board certified medical doctor and nutrition expert with training from Cornell, Columbia, and Harvard University, and she truly knows her stuff. She has a huge heart, incredibly insightful, and this led to creating this incredibly dynamic and rich conversation. I'm telling you, there's aha moment after aha moment, tons of tips and insights and just things that I never even talked about before I was able to share and express. And so I'm so grateful to be able to share this with you today. Now before we get to this very special conversation, I wanna share something with you that is time sensitive. It's time sensitive. Starting right now for just a few days right now where I get some of my most prized and valued immune system support new tropics for improved cognitive performance and so much more.

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So many different applications for propolis. And again, this is just one of the things you get access to for 25% off for a few days only. May 21st through May 27. When you go to beekeepers naturals.com/model, take advantage because it's for a limited time only. And on that note, let's dive into this powerful conversation that again, it took place right here at the Model Health Show Studio with my good friend and colleague, Dr. Amy Shah interviewing me for her new hit show The skyrocketing up the charts. Save Yourself with Dr. Amy Shah. We're gonna be talking about the impact that being around other people has on our microbiome. Which hormone has been found to be an antidote to stress? The top two things to prioritize for great health and so much more. Please enjoy this special conversation with me being interviewed on the Hit show. Save yourself with Dr. Amy Shah.

DR. AMY SHAH: Shawn Stevenson, thank you so much for coming on my podcast, but in your studio. Thanks for coming on the, it's called Save Yourself with Dr. Amy Shaw, because we talk about, and I know you're all about that, really, we can't control everybody in our world, but we can control ourselves and we can save ourselves. So I'm so grateful for you to be here. If people don't know, you're the bestselling author of Sleep Smarter and now you have the brand new cookbook. It's Eat Smarter, but Family Cookbook, which is an amazing resource for people, and we'll talk about that a little bit. But I wanted to start out by, first of all, thanking you so much because.

I reached out to you for the first time and I said, Hey, I have a book coming out. I don't know anything about this world. I'm kind of just getting my feet wet, and you offered to get on a call with me. I. And you said, you know, gave me a bunch of advice about books and being in this world, literally I felt like I was like a newborn in this world, a wellness world. I was just like a doctor, you know, going to work, seeing patients coming home, and then all of a sudden I'm in this new universe, really. And I think back to that time because honestly, so much of what you told me really set the stage for me and my path forward. And I'm nowhere near where I wanna be, but I'm in like leaps and bounds ahead of what I would be if I didn't have people like you kind of helping me along the way. So thank you so much. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Oh man, I said this to you before. You deserve it. You know, I knew that there was something remarkable about you. Obviously I don't get on the phone with babies very often.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, you being a newborn.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: But, you know, just seeing.. 

DR. AMY SHAH: That's what I was gonna say. What did you, what did you even think? Like were you like, oh my God, this annoying person reaching out to you. I mean, that's what people, you know, that's what happens. Right. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: But also the, we had the connective tissue because you found out about me years before.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, when you were working on your own wellness journey.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And that resonated with me. You know, to see the potential impact that you can have and that you were already doing or putting things in place. And I just wanted to see you take off and change the world. 

DR. AMY SHAH: You really, and you know what you did. I'm sure you remember this, but, that time you got on the phone and you send voice memos to a bunch of other podcasters and was like, Hey, she's gonna come out to la and you put in a good word for me. And that meant so much because I was, I came to la I did your podcast and I did a few others. And, all of that kind of set the stage for everything that would come after that. And so, thanks so much. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: I got the chills. Thanks. 

DR. AMY SHAH: You know, really I had to give you the big, I think when I went to Europe this summer, I realized how connected everybody is in Europe, at least where I was. At this conference, it was a medical conference, longevity and aesthetics, which we'll talk about longevity, but, and everyone, their personalities, the Bul, Bulgarians, it was in Bulgaria. The Bulgarians were so. They were so connected. Like they wanted to help each other. They wanted to talk to each other. I think we, in America, we live in silos and we live these very, very independent lives because that's what we've been told. We're like, yeah, like, just work on yourself. Go. And I think we forget the power of connection. And I know that your book, the, the Eat Smarter Cookbook is really about connection. What really prompted you to write that? 

SHAWN STEVENSON: It's really just kind of completing the, the puzzle because the individuality is such an important aspect. When you were talking about that, that experience with the Bulgarians, I was thinking about the microbiome, right?

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And just how each individual microbe has its own particular job, its own aspirations. Its own, desires and wishes and fears and things that it's moving away from moving towards. We're all individuals, but we're part of this incredible collective. You know, I really see being here on planet Earth, we're like in a glorified snow globe. We're kind of like little cells in this global body, you know? And in America, yes, we've been more of like the individual is the way and do everything you can to lift yourself up, and that absolutely has its place. But. Little did we know we're missing out on really the most important part about being human, which is each other, you know?

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And you know, you come from a culture where, you know, different lineages. You know, different generations are often in the same house, right? And that's something we've really kind of, I'm not gonna even say evolved. We've devolved and moved away from that.

DR. AMY SHAH: Oh my gosh.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Where not only are we not in the same home, but not even in the same neighborhood, not even now we're in different cities. Oftentimes I know that that's the case for me, you know, with my family. And as we move further and further away, things have become, ironically, more and more difficult, right. We've seen benefits with some other things. Let's not negate that. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Right. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: But we need each other. And really, the catalyst for writing this book was the, I'm, you know, I'm a scientist. The data was too eyeopening, too mind blowing. And I'm just like, people do not know this. And not just us getting together with the people that we love, but. Especially under the umbrella of food and eating together. This is something that dates back, like as far as we can date back and find humans. Humans have been eating together and we've been participating together in the process of eating. So the hunting, the gathering, the food preparation, and eating together. This was really a time for being able to share knowledge, right? Before the advent of writing and books and things like that, not too long ago we went to Maui and we, you know, they had the luau. Which, as I'm watching it, I'm seeing this from different eyes because..

DR. AMY SHAH: Pig.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right! So they come out with the pig, of course. It's just like they're pretending that they hunted the pig. Right?

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And then they do the whole thing. They're telling stories through song and through dance. And we're seen as kind of dramatization of something that humans have done for thousands of years, which is. After we procure this real food from nature, we share this time together and we pass down information, right, to help the new generations to keep moving humanity forward. And so having this opportunity to like, let's circle back to that and integrate more time with family intentionally, especially with food.

And I'm just gonna throw this out here really quickly. One of the studies that jumped out to me initially that was just like got me thinking about writing a book about this was a huge database from some researchers at Harvard who were just collecting data on family eating behaviors. And after they compiled the data, they found that when families eat together, and this is gonna seem obvious, but when families eat together, they tend to eat significantly more fruits and vegetables, more nutrient dense foods. Specifically, they found they had far more micronutrients and macronutrients that helped to prevent diseases in these family members. And they ate significantly less ultra processed foods just by eating together more often. And so it got me thinking like, is this because they have time because they're more educated?

Is that why, you know, because. I'm always trying to like poke holes in my own beliefs, right? Questioning. And this is a really important takeaway for anybody who's interested in health today because you know, we can get very dogmatic about things. And so I found another study that was done on minority children, which is where I come from. I, you know, when I changed my own health and when I was going to college, even, I lived in Ferguson, Missouri, and they track the eating behavior of these children. They found that if the kids ate with their parents or their caregivers, at least four meals per week, this could be any meal. This could be breakfast, this could be dinner, didn't matter.

The children ate five or more servings of fruits and vegetables at least five days a week just by eating together on those four occasions. But here's what the researchers noted, specifically when the TV was never or rarely on. That was the key. Like there's something distracting about television. Our devices and all our devices in a way are dividing us. And so having that focus time together is leading to better outcomes for our kids and for ourselves. 

DR. AMY SHAH: And, my kids, Laura, my daughter's in the room, she, they get so annoyed with me because I say even when your phone is on the table.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah.

DR. AMY SHAH: Insight. Your part of your attention is just based on not picking up the phone. So like stopping your urge to look at the phone. And so you cannot focus on the ta, like the people who are speaking to you if you have your phone right there. So you put it away, out of sight, out of mind, and you really are present there. And I think that what you said about the TV or smartphones, I mean, nowadays this is like the big, big thing. And I think when you said about the microbiome, like I always think of the microbiome as one of the biggest, you know, drivers for mind, body and spirit health. They need other microbes. They need to interact with other, even though they're deep in our gut, our microbiome really benefits from being around other people's microbiomes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: It's like file sharing. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yes. And they wanna like, whoever you are. You are the sum of the people that you spend the most time with because your microbiome is the sum of the people you spend your most time with.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Absolutely. Yeah.

DR. AMY SHAH: So think about who you're spending time with because your microbiome is reflecting those people, and then you realize the importance of sharing meals together with people that you care about, because that to me. Oh wow, like I could shape my microbiome based on who I'm spending time with and vice versa. You wanna share your microbiome with your children, with your family members, so that you are all benefiting from the things that you do. Like athletic prowess of mood everything comes from your microbiome.

SHAWN STEVENSON: It's that proximity.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, and I, I remember the statement I first heard Tony Robbins say this, said, proximity is power. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah, totally. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, and being close to certain things. That's how we really connected.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, and the same thing holds true with this opportunity like to intentionally put ourselves around healthy people.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right. It's not just the fact that, you know, this isn't a super, just a superficial thing. Right. There's a statement that you're the average of the five people that you hang around the most. One of the most profound things that I heard, and this was from a really renowned psychiatrist, is that you are, you are the average of the five nervous systems.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: That you're around the most as well. 

DR. AMY SHAH: And five microbiomes. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: And five microbiome. Like it just keeps getting deeper and deeper. But the thing is, we're limited. As human beings with our perspective in a way, because we can't see so much like we have, we have senses that are attuned to a certain reality.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And so we can't see all of this stuff, like these trillions of processes that are happening. You know, right here in this room, we've we're existing in this like cloud of microbial data. Right. And recently, of course we have a lot of fear around that, but it's one of the most healthy things. And health affirming, it's kind of like having our immune system being able to do a light workout.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, when we're able to share data because as you know, so much of our microbiome is related to our immune system function. 

DR. AMY SHAH: A hundred percent. Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: So it's just doing this around in the context of eating good food together and just being close again. And by the way, for people that are just like, well, I'm gonna wait. I'm not close to my family either, you know? This includes friends, too, you know, it's just not limited to, you know, the nuclear family or extended family. But now we can choose, like my, my mother-in-law, I'm about to fly her into town like I think next week or the next week or two. And, you know, just having that opportunity as much as we actually we're, we're working to move her here.

DR. AMY SHAH: Amazing.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Just to be ar so she could be around. And also now data's coming out that when we have multiple generations who are in the same home, they live longer, by the way. And live more healthfully, lower rates of things like dementia and the list goes on and on. And it ne doesn't necessarily mean being under the same roof, but just being in proximity to your grandkids.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right. It provides a sense of purpose. And so if you don't have that, because I didn't, I, I lost that, you know. My, I had, I. You know my.

DR. AMY SHAH: I remember you mentioned, yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: My grandmother was really like my first love, you know?

DR. AMY SHAH: Aw.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And, she passed away prematurely, as did my, my grandfather and she stuck around just till I got married. You know, and he passed away, you know, a couple years before that. And shortly thereafter she passed away and I was just still a kid. Really? You know, I was like 26. And, you know, I would love, like every day I see her picture and I was just like, she would love my youngest son so much, you know? But I didn't know what I know now. And actually she passed away from overdose from medication. All right. My grandfather. 

DR. AMY SHAH: What medication, if you don't mind me asking. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Ah, so this was, this is tough. I mean, this was intentional. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right. So she had.

DR. AMY SHAH: I'm sorry.

SHAWN STEVENSON: A slew of medications that she was on, and she really died from a broken heart. You know, my grandfather passed away. And he had multiple open heart surgeries and just, you know, he was really beaten down from that process. But early on, like when I lived with him for several years when I was a kid. I remember the switchover very clearly. Like I remember my grandfather, he, he hunted, they had a garden. But he had this thing he loved, and this is the weirdest thing. He would, I've never shared this before, but he would mix up the syrup with Jiffy Peanut butter.

DR. AMY SHAH: Okay.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right. And like mix it up into this mixture and then put on a plate and then put a piece of white bread on top of that and eat it all right. I don't know what he calls that. I don't, you know, the pop special or something. But, you know, and looking at the ingredients of that Jiffy, I mean, fully hydrogenated vegetable oil, and it's not real maple syrup. Yeah. It's just like anima, whatever. You know? And here's what happened when he had, you know, high blood pressure, hypertension, his physician had my grandmother to take away all. And by the way, as I'm sharing that, that was like the one weird thing that I saw him have. They ate a lot of butter and, you know.

DR. AMY SHAH: Real food.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, the deer that he would hunt and stuff like that. Because he had just minor levels, high levels of hypertension. It took him off all fat. So she put him on a low fat diet. This is when country Crock became predominant, right. Started cooking with vegetable oil and it went from, you know, concerning to worse. Right. And then the progression just went from there. So, yeah. 

DR. AMY SHAH: It's so terrible. I mean, you think about what we didn't know back then, and a lot of the things that you're saying in your cookbook and what we talk about is kind of the mistakes we've made in the last 80 to a hundred years with, with nutrition. I mean, nutrition has gone completely haywire. It's become food-like substances, like you're saying. These hydrogenated spreads are terrible for you. Much worse than the, you know, other things that you could be putting on. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Ultra processed food. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Ultra processed food.

SHAWN STEVENSON: True nature of it.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. It's just so terrible. Well, I wanna go back to the grandparents thing. So, my journey hap included my parents all the way because, when I got pregnant, I found out the hard way that there's no maternity leave in medical residency or fellowship. And I said to my parents, I said to my dad, I don't know how I'm gonna do this. Like, I have to go back. I have only two weeks of vacation and he's like, don't worry, we'll be there for you. He's like, my parents were there for me when we moved to this country. They, you know, his mom, um, really took care of us when we were little. And so my mom would come and stay with us for prolonged periods of time.

And, and then lo and behold, um, you know, Laura, I got pregnant with Laura about a year and a half later. And so it kind of ended up being this long period while I was in training, in residency training that my mom was there and my dad would come on the weekends or come when he could. 

And then when we moved after finishing fellowship, my kids were, Laura was six months old and my son was two. And they said, don't worry, we got you. You have a new practice. You're starting this new world. We got you. We'll help you. We'll help the kids. We love being with them. Keeps us happy. And my dad started working remotely and helped me. And I can't tell you what an impact it had on my life. I couldn't, I could not do.

I know people have amazing nannies and more power to them. They have family members, but having your parents there to support you and your family when they're really young and when your careers really young, it was priceless. And the fact that I would come home and my kids would be fed and bathed at it was like late in the evening and we had dinner together, and then we would just, that was, that was it. Like we didn't, I didn't have to worry about anything. And so the power of that and the power, when we talk about menopause, and I know we're gonna touch on that. Women. Human women are the only species on earth that live past. Ovaries, meaning their ovaries die in their fifties, but they live well past that.

And evolutionarily, we think because of this duty that they have such a big role in the family structure, in the community ,over the thousands of years that evolutionarily they were chosen to live well past their fertility age. And so I think that's so beautiful. Like we are meant to be taking care of our grandchildren or just the community or giving something to this world well beyond, you know, age 45 or 50 or whenever people stop having ovulation. So I think all of that kind of fits in this role of, you know, we are supposed to be communities are, we are built this way, evolutionarily, we were supposed to be this way. And the more we. Pull ourselves away from that. The worst it gets. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah. As women are taking care of us, as my grandmother's taking care of, of me the environment. We need to be taking care of her as well.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, and respecting her and providing an environment for her to thrive so that that relationship can continue. You know? But that's really one of the issues today. And you know, again, not to be too gloomy about this part of the issue. You know, I live with my grandma for a while, but it's because my mom, you know, was just kind of struggling, you know? And I would stay at her house sometimes on the weekends, but it was just really, you know, violent environment. You know, the neighborhood that we're in, you know, there's gangs, there's violence, there's, you know, drug use, you know, alcoholism, violence in the household, all those things. And you know, even being in that environment, there's still an opportunity. You know, it's just, because of en being in that environment, I became more self-centered and like protective of myself. So I, I cut myself off.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And I felt so much more happy and sovereign being alone.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right. So I'm saying all that to say that I definitely had Lone Wolf syndrome.

DR. AMY SHAH: Totally.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, to a high degree. And even getting into this field, like it was shocking to me when the first person that I helped, I was still in college and I became a personal trainer at the university gym. And I couldn't believe I went from like being so focused on self to being of service to other people. I've even lost myself in that too.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know? 'cause you could swing this pendulum either way. Now finding that happy medium, which is appropriate for so much in life, you know, the yin and yang. It was me having the revelation, thankfully, that I get to create that family. Right. So, but I had the story and I'm speaking to those people who feel like, well, that I, I just don't have that. And, and so it is right. If you are, if that is your belief and that's what you're focused on, that's what you're gonna have. I opened myself up too, like, I'm so excited about my mother-in-law coming out here.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: There's so many like. Mother-in-law jokes.

DR. AMY SHAH: Right, right.

SHAWN STEVENSON: About how there's not, you know, it's not a vibe. I love her so much. She's, she's really my greatest teacher in this field of health. But I, I intentionally, in a way, some of this kind of happened along the way because even when she came into my life, I was still keeping a distance. I didn't accept how much she loved me. You know, she, my first book that I self-published way back probably, what, 15 years ago, she, she spent, and I'm just, I'm just gonna say it, she spent $10,000 of her savings and bought those books. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Wow.

SHAWN STEVENSON: From the printer, 'cause at the time, again, there wasn't like this distribution, all this stuff.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: We needed the inventory, right? She invested in me, you know.

DR. AMY SHAH: Wow.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And, you know, since then.

DR. AMY SHAH: What a gift.

SHAWN STEVENSON: I've taken the best care, like, she's been all over the world. You know, I've been able to do these amazing things for her. And part of the reason that I've. You know, work so hard in this field is to make her proud. You know, and we've got other, and this is a crazy thing, I'm sharing this with you. I haven't really spoke this out loud. But many of my friends are like significantly older than me, like 20, 30 years. But these are like, they're, they're like grandparents. Right?

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: They're like grandparents for my kids, you know? And it's so amazing. Like, I, you, you can create this no matter where you are right now, but we've gotta start, we've gotta make it more intentional to spend time, especially today. Life is not slowing down anytime soon. You know, technology is getting more and more integrated into things. But we need each other. We need that file sharing. We need those inputs, you know, around the dinner table, especially for our kids. So there was a study published in pediatrics that looked at family eating behavior and obesity and eating disorders in kids. And I'm a big minimum effective dose person too.

Like, okay, we know we got data, but how, how long? How many times do we need to do this? And they found the minimum was three meals per week. Those children eating with their parents or caregivers, three meals per week significantly decreased their development of obesity and disordered eating. All right. So we know that it's protective for kids. It's protective for us as well. A great analysis was done with tech workers at IBM and what they did was they, they tracked their job satisfaction, productivity, stress levels, and they found that if those. Parents were able to get home, get home for dinner, right home in time for dinner. Their work morale stayed high. Productivity stayed high. Stress stayed manageable, but as soon as obligations cut into their ability to spend time with their family after work, productivity goes down. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Interesting. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Job satisfaction plummets, and most importantly, stress skyrockets. Being with each other helps us to metabolize stress. And that's one of the most overlooked aspects of it. We've got a quick break coming up. We'll be right back.

Yes, we live in a toxic world, but there's no need to make plans to get onto that spaceship with Katy Perry. Alright. Things are gonna be all right. We are resilient. We have the capacity for so much to heal and our bodies know what to do to deal with so much of the things that we're exposed to now. To keep it 1000, there are thousands of newly evicted chemicals that our bodies are now dealing with literally on a daily basis. We can't escape it, you know, it's in the very air that we breathe. Our food, our water system, the clothes that we wear, the list goes on and on. But again, our bodies are resilient.

There's no need to hide and fear. Yes, we absolutely want to reduce our toxic load, but simple things, time tested things can support our body's ability to detoxify some of the most nefarious compounds and metabolic waste products if we provide our bodies, again, with the basic things that it needs to do. So, one of the simplest, most overlooked things was highlighted in a 2021 study published in the Journal of Frontiers and Nutrition. That determine that Vitamin C has a remarkable impact on restoring the health of one of our primary organs of detoxification, which is our liver, and they noted that it has this powerful impact on restoring liver health of people, even with non-alcoholic fatty liver disease.

The researcher stated " A total of 12 weeks of vitamin C supplementation improved liver health and glucose metabolism. In patients with non-alcoholic fatty liver disease." Vitamin C is one of the most essential nutrients that assists our body in processing and removing toxins and metabolic waste from our systems. Of course, we make sure that we're eating plenty of vitamin C rich foods, but today in the world that we're living in. If we're not trying to get on that spaceship with Katie and Gail, we need to be more mindful of getting in those vitamin C rich foods. And this is also a place to supplement, at least on an occasional basis.

Now, this might come as a revelation for many people of the impact of vitamin C on detoxification, but this has been known for literally about a century now, documented in scientific journals. In fact, a study published in the Journal of the American Medical Association in 1941, detailed how vitamin C is a powerful "detoxifying agent." Specifically noting its benefit in reducing the toxic load from drug metabolism, which again has a lot to do with our liver. Number one, eat plenty of vitamin C rich foods. Number two, supplement with real science backed vitamin C. And I'm saying that with emphasis because today most vitamin C supplements are made artificially in a lab from genetically modified corn. The only vitamin C supplement that I use, and I've been utilizing it for years, is from a combination of three of the most vitamin C dense superfoods ever discovered, camou, camo berry, amla berry, and AC cherry.

All of this is found in the essential C Complex from Paleo Valley. Go to paleo valley.com/model and you're going to get 15% off their incredible essential C formula, as well as the rest of their phenomenal supplements, snacks, and foods. Paleo Valley is a big part of my family's lives. Also, the guest here at the Model Health Show Studio, my team, it's a staple in our lives. I truly do appreciate the integrity in which they do things. Their essential C Complex has no binders, no fillers, nothing nefarious in that amazing formula, and the ingredients themselves are backed by science. Head over to paleo valley.com/model. That's P-A-L-E-O-V-A-L-L-E-Y.com/model for 15% off. And now back to the show.

DR. AMY SHAH: I have this the perfect ad for your book. I saw this social media graphic and maybe I'll send it to you when I get a chance. US population spends the least amount of time at tables. Meaning eating at tables, and has the highest rates of obesity. All the countries that spend the least amount of time at tables and the countries that spend the most amount of time at tables have the healthiest, you know, overall populations. And it just means, like you think about it, wait, are these, if they're sitting at a table, aren't they eating more? Aren't they eating more, like drinking more, eating more desserts or whatever? But no, if you think about it, that's what we think, right? We think if we sit down and eat, we're gonna overeat or we're going to, at least a lot of us think we're too busy, we gotta just eat on the go.

You gotta have a protein shake or bar, you know, like that's healthy. But real health is actually sitting down and looking at the food that you're eating or conversing with someone on a table. And I think that's the best ad for your book that you could ever have, is like, Hey, look, we need to understand the statistics. This doesn't, this is opposite of what you've been taught for the last whatever number of years. For me, growing up in med school, in training, I always thought it was a waste of time to go out to dinner with friends or family, just thought, oh my God, I should ra. I'd rather read, be studying with my food and it's just the opposite. It's so crazy that the people that spend the most time at tables, the countries that spend the most, they're the healthiest, right? Like, and we're in the drive-throughs, we're eating on the go. I don't know, have you ever been to Japan? 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Listen, I just text my wife this.

DR. AMY SHAH: I'm gonna give you my itinerary.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Literally before I came in here. All right? Yeah. I haven't been, I just text her. There was a great. Um, snippet from Anthony Bourdain, and he had talked, obviously with the most incredible chefs from every country, you know, the most notable countries for food. And just asking them if they had a choice. The top French chef, the top chef in Italy. You know, where would you live and eat for the rest of your life if you can only live in one place and eat the food for the rest of your life? And he's like, most of them said, Japan, 

DR. AMY SHAH: I'm telling you, it's right up your alley. Because one of the things th they don't follow American culture as closely as so many of the oth other countries that we often visit. Right. And one of the things I notice, and I know you'll notice all these nutritional things too, because you're in this world, I noticed that there was no to go. Like you could not get a to-go. Nobody. There's no trash cans anywhere. First of all, there's no to-go cups, there's no to-go plates. Nobody's eating on the go and everyone walks there.

So it's not like you're in your car eating. And I thought that was so strange because in America, we're all on the go all the time. Almost everything is on the go, right? Even when you have kids, you know, you're just telling 'em about your son's tournaments, like you are going to these tournaments, you're getting something on the run. They're getting something on the run, right? Like that's our culture. And to go somewhere where they were like, no, we don't have a to go, or you have to eat it right there. Like if you order food, like they just give it to you and you're supposed to stand there or sit on this little stool, finish it. And then go underway. Like how crazy is that? 

SHAWN STEVENSON: You, you gotta slow down. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: And also, and this is when, you know, your, your phone has gotta be listening to you for it to send me that. I'm watching Show Gun Oh, on FX/Hulu with my wife right now as well, which is based in Japan. And then I get that and I sent my, send it to my wife like, Hey, we should probably go. And also, again, just looking at the data, their obesity rate near 5% versus almost 50% here. It is. It it's, it's really remarkable.

DR. AMY SHAH: They have some blue zone, they have a blue zone there too. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Exactly. Yeah. And just looking at these principles, like what, what are those ingredients? It's not just the diet. The diet matters. Absolutely. But what's not talked about unfortunately, is how diverse the diets are in these different Blue Zones, alright. The consistent thing, movement and the over, the thing that ties it all together is community, in all of these places, it is the standout thing. As a matter of fact, I had a conversation with the director of the longest running longitudinal human study on longevity.

Like what are the ingredients that show specifically. What makes humans live longer. And he was like, yes, exercise matters, not smoking matters. But the thing that stood out far and away was the quality of your relationships. Having warm, as he called it, warm social bonds. And from his data, and he's the fourth director, it's like a 80 year study to get the baton passed to them.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And I like, I like him because he's also skeptical, you know? Yeah. And so he was trying to find what's the mechanism. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: And the mechanism that stands out with a good amount of data is that it helps to get to metabolize stress. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON:  Just knowing that somebody is there for you, that has your back at the end of a process, at the end of a day, or just, you know, to share good times with having another human being to experience these things, or human beings is so good for our brain and for our nervous system, our endocrine system. And this was what was also one of the standout reasons in the book when you said about the tables, that's so fascinating, by the way. In the book I shared that the dinner table acts as a unifier. That's what it really is, it's a unifier. And eating, we know that just being with each other, we're producing different chemistry, but now so much science. I've been talking about this for 10 years. So much science is coming out now about oxytocin. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: I was talking about in the context of sleep quality, you know, 10 years ago. But now it's, you know, getting all these different nicknames, you know, bonding hormone, cuddle hormone, love hormone. It's far more than that. It does support bonding with humans, but it's really, and I don't want to. I don't want to use this word, but I'm gonna use it. But it's really an antidote to stress. In many ways it's a strong word to use that, but this is just what's showing up in the data. It's one of the few hormones that can really counteract the activity of cortisol.

Right. And cortisol is complicated. It's not bad. It's just, it can get out of balance, right. And so having a boost of oxytocin really can help to neutralize cortisol abnormality in the body. And it's like a, it's like a hack that has been there throughout our evolution. All we gotta do is just be around each other. Hug somebody. Share a meal together and you're gonna get these benefits. 

DR. AMY SHAH: That's the purpose of oxytocin, we think is to, is to promote those behaviors. And so our body does that to promote more of that because you feel good, you're gonna do more of it. And that helps us evolve, as you know, as humans. Okay, you've been in this world now for what, over 20 years? 

SHAWN STEVENSON: 22 years here in about a month. 

DR. AMY SHAH: So 22 years.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Crazy.

DR. AMY SHAH: What if somebody was like coming to this brand new and they're like, I can't do a thousand things. I can't do all the things I need to do for a better health, better life, better, you know, internal environment. What would be kind of the top things? Maybe three to five things you'd say, Hey, listen, I know you hear everything, you hear all these things, but you gotta start with these three things. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Oh, you know, this is tough. When, when I found success working with people as a clinician, it was personalizing things, right. So the generalities I'm gonna give them, because for most people they are gonna work, but you still gotta base things on your unique circumstances because we all need a little more, a little less of some things at different times. With that being said across the board, number one is shifting your ratio of ultra processed foods.

Right? So, eat real food. Eat real food. If you just focus on most of your meals consist of real food and of case of course, if you come in contact, you know, with the bowl of Lucky Charms or whatever the case might be every now and then, so be it like we live in the world. There's weird, fun stuff to eat out here, but eat real food stuff. And this isn't, I'm not talking about. Matter of fact, let's share where we are with, with ultra processed foods. And I've been talking about this for several years now, but, so about three years ago, an analysis came on the BMJ and it found that America, we eat more ultra processed food than anybody. Big surprise.

So the average American Eats, about 60% of their diet is ultra processed foods. Another study that came out just a couple of years ago was published in JAMA, looking at ultra processed food consumption by our children. And it tracked from 1999, the average child was eating already 62% ultra processed foods, and by 2018, that number had risen to almost 70%. All right, so most of our children's diet is fake food. So just to clarify also, when I'm saying ultra processed food, and I see some of my colleagues are making this distinction, thankfully, because I came outta the gate saying, Hey. We've been processing food for a long time. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. Yeah. All right. It's not about processing.

SHAWN STEVENSON: So you wanna like, understand the, the distinction, right? Like if we're making olive oil from olives, that food is still radically healthy. If we are making some pasta sauce from tomatoes, right? If you're cooking your food, you're processing the food. If you're cooking it, that's not the issue. Ultra processed foods are newly invented chemical complexes that, for example, I mentioned Lucky Charms earlier. There was a time, there was, there's some parts of that bowl of Lucky Charms that far away in the galaxy, far, far away. It was made from bits of corn. All right. There was, there was some corn involved. Alright. But it went through so much processing, so many different chemical additives. And this is the big thing. This stuff doesn't show up on that label. Yeah. As you're leave reading that label, label for that box of cereal, it might have. You know, 12 ingredients. There are hundreds or even thousands of chemicals that are involved in processing that food that are not on that label.

And many of these compounds are now affirmed to be carcinogens, obesogens, they're banned in many countries. But here in the United States, we're just oblivious to the fact that that's happening when we're eating this food, we're getting, and it might even be micro amounts, you know, but we are consuming all of these different newly invented chemicals, food dies, um, you know, solvents, you know, hexane to be able to extract the, the vegetable oils and the list goes on and on. And we're really eating a chemical soup, it's not real food. All right. So ultra processed foods are things that you can't recognize where they come from. Period. Like if you were to give a box of Pop-Tarts to, you know, somebody, a Maasai, you know, a person in the Maasai tribe. My, my mother-in-law and my wife, they're from Kenya.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: But the Maasai, you know, they're some of the healthiest people on Earth, and they have a very strange diet. You know, they have the. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: The, the cows and, you know, whatever the blood and the, and the, the dairy and whatnot. But they're, I don't know if you saw this recently, they're being studied because they can jump so high. They have frequent, frequently. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: High jumpers and athletes. But if you were to present n now, I mean, I'm sure some guys in the tribe has some smartphones now, so I'm not, but maybe like 20 years ago, present them with a box of Poptarts. Like, where did this come from? 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: They would have no clue. No Lucky charms, no clue. Doritos, no clue. 

DR. AMY SHAH: How do you min minimize that? So you're saying that's number one, right? Yeah. Minimize that. So practically, how do you minimize that? 

SHAWN STEVENSON: It is, the simplicity makes it complicated, alright. And it is as simple as eating when you eat your meals, just asking the question, you know, can I recognize where this came from? Right. So if you're having your breakfast and it's some eggs and fruit, you know, or some avocado, or something like that, or even, even toast, right? Even if you're eating some sourdough bread, for example, it's just a couple of steps from being wheat. All right? This isn't that far removed from that.

So it's still like that's, it's, it's processed food, it's, it can be a little bit more refined, but it's still, it's still fits that category of being a real food. With that said, there are degrees with that when it comes to bread, but just asking, is this real food, right? A step or two from where, where its origins are. With that said, we can take those foods and make some incredible meals with them, right? So I just saw my friend Michael Beckwith, who's another one of those people who's a mentor for me. He's a couple decades, my senior, but last time he was over at my house, we made this amazing enchilada casserole for him.

That's in the, in the Eat Smarter Family Cookbook, by the way. And you know, there's a vegetarian, vegan version, then there's a version where you could add different protein or whatever, but it's so good. It's so ridiculously good. But it's got all these different real food ingredients, right? So it's got, you know, it, one of the secret ingredients that gives its, its body is sweet potatoes, right?

DR. AMY SHAH: Oh, wow.

SHAWN STEVENSON: But it's like layered into this enchilada version, you know, with different vegetables and things like that. And it can, you can have your protein of choice. It tastes like a really, a cross between like a, a pizza and enchilada. It's, wow, it's a fire. It's amazing. But we could take those real food ingredients and make some amazing food experiences, you know, so that's, that's the principle. That's the, that's the modus operandi, just asking like, can I recognize where this came from? And leaning a little bit into simplicity for our meals. And with that said, you can have a little of the fun stuff. Just make sure that you get your real food in there and that meal, and, you know, sprinkle in a little bit of, you know, whatever it might be. You know, I, I'm thinking of conjuring up so many.. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Inappropriate foods that I'm gonna, that I'm gonna say, but like, 'cause there's some, there's some crazy stuff out here now. Amy, I don't know if you. So, when I was a kid, my favorite cereal was fruity Pebbles. But now there's like fruity, pebble crispy treats or rice crispy treats.

DR. AMY SHAH: Oh my gosh.

SHAWN STEVENSON: There's fruity Pebbles donuts. There's like, there's so many monstrosities that can be created with these delicious, and by the way, this is the thing. They're, they're delicious. They're chemically sci, these intelligent scientists created them to be incredibly delicious. And I know, I actually know how it works now. Yeah. 

And, just understanding that stuff exists and we are humans living in, you know, this time right now. And there's all kinds of fun stuff. Humans are driven to eat tasty things. We have colleagues who are very much in the camp of like, eat to live, don't live to eat. And I get it, but we are hardwired, our biology is driven to eat delicious things.

Every creature really is, is drawn towards things that taste good to them? Have you ever thought about like, why does a certain animal eat a certain thing? Another part of that though, and we have this as well as humans, but it can get it's kind of calloused now, is we're also drawn to foods that heal us and support us. There's this phenomenon called post ingested feedback. Right? So when we eat a food, our cells, this infinite intelligence, we don't even, we we're starting to understand, but it's basically keeping track of what we got from that food. Right. So if I ate some cherries, some dark cherries, my body is keeping tabs on, I got um, some vitamin C, I got some anthocyanins, I've got some melatonin in a f in a food.

That's interesting. So your body's like taking notes on all this stuff and when we eat that food, it's connecting those nutrients with certain flavors. And so if we would become deficient in these things or maybe sick or need certain things, we'd have a craving to go and seek those things out in our environment, right? So post ingested feedback, and there's great studies that are done on this, but that phenomenon is for humans has really been screwed up because ultra processed foods, because you could take that cherry flavor right. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Now you want a cherry coke. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right!

DR. AMY SHAH: I'm just kidding.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You could take it, right? You take it, a gas chromatograph can isolate the chemistry that makes that cherry flavor. It doesn't have to be exact, but like now we can add that cherry flavor to things that are not cherry. And so all of this biochemistry is just screwed up and we don't know what we crave anymore, like that inner, inner intelligence. 

But as you start to eat more real food, and that's what I tell people, like it's difficult for me because I just listen to my body. You know, my body knows what. What to eat, you know? And of course like I'll add in things proactively here or there. But I really just kind of know and have a feeling for what, what is good for me right now. 

DR. AMY SHAH: It's so interesting 'cause it's so hard. Intuitive eating is really hard if you're eating a lot of ultra processed foods. But when you decrease the amount of ultra processed foods you eat, then you can kind of lean into that intuition. I think that's where it gets confusing for people. So if that's number one, do you have a second one or is that the main, like if you had to start somewhere, that's where you would start.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Number two would be to prioritize your sleep, you know, and of, of course I've done a lot of work on this and I'm grateful that this has become kind of part of popular culture now. Sleep wellness, but we're still not doing it. You know, I know so many people because we've got this curve ball of technology being more invasive in our lives and. You know, and I'm, I'm thinking about, you know, this publisher has been reaching out about doing a revised edition of Sleep Smarter, but just.

DR. AMY SHAH: Smartphone edition.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah. Like it is a serious issue. Now we have data on what it is. Researchers at Harvard finding how it suppresses melatonin increases cortisol before bed and whatnot. But now it's like there's more data on this. It's not just this melatonin cortisol connection, but it's like dopamine. It's like noradrenaline and adrenaline. It's just like all of this chemistry and you could be tired. You could be physiologically exhausted and even pass out, but you're not gonna go through your sleep cycles efficiently. If you're on your device before you go to bed, like it just really gums up the, the system. 

DR. AMY SHAH: What about those people? And I work with a lot of women, right, that prioritize their sleep because they know how much it means to them the next day, but they wake up in the middle of the night, say two o'clock, three o'clock, four o'clock. This is like a huge question I get all the time. I was curious about your thoughts on that. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Why they're waking up? 

DR. AMY SHAH: Or like what they can do to stop that. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: So this, I'm, this, this is a incredible question and it's multifaceted because everybody's different, you know? This could be anything ranging from, you know, some hormonal things going on. You know, maybe for some reason cortisols kicking on at that point. And we need to look at like helping to smooth out your cortisol rhythm. This could be stress. You know, but not just cortisol related, but like psychological. You're processing things and something is like quote, keeping you up at night. Yeah. This could be blood sugar issues, you know, this could be nutrient deficiencies. There's so many different things that consider here, but most importantly, the number one solution practically. Yeah. We can address all those things. It's just to not be so hard on yourself, you know, because we can become neurotic about like, I'm okay. I need to get this amount of sleep.

DR. AMY SHAH: I Know. Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: What we know now is that yes, sleep mode is absolutely, it's, it's a superpower. It's the most anabolic state humans can be in. But just slowing down, meditating, just breathing. You know, even if you wake up, just taking time and just knowing things are well and taking the opportunity to, you know, do some breathing exercises and to decompress. Maybe focus on some things that, and it's tough if you're going through something. You know, maybe that's what's keeping you up. It's just to be able to put your attention on things that you're grateful for or. You know, the, the good things that have happened in your life that have gotten you to where you are, those things that maybe you didn't think you'd be able to make it through, that you did, you know, just being able to take a little bit more control of your, of your emotions in that moment. And know that meditation is also very anabolic, right? So we can get some of those benefits of sleep just by you focusing on your breathing, because that's gonna help you to stay in that like parasympathetic, you know, rest and digest. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah, because like that nons, sleep, rest, that's really important too, if you can't go back to sleep. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: When I've mentioned nutrient deficiencies really quickly. You could have the most fancy pants mattress ever created. You could have the blackout curtains, you could have all of the gadgets and the gizmos. If you are deficient in the nutrients that build your sleep related hormones and neurotransmitters, you're gonna have problems sleeping. So what are some of those really quickly, and I call 'em good sleep nutrients. One of the most profound, surprisingly, but it does so much, which it shouldn't be that surprising, is vitamin C. Right. So there was a study done in plus one that found that folks who, of course deficient vitamin C, they were having more interrupted sleep, they were waking up more often, and by getting more vitamin C nutrition in help to resolve that.

Another one is, and there's so many I'm thinking about right now, but I'll just share omega threes. I know you talk about omega threes quite a bit, especially for your sleep quality. Actually there's researchers at Oxford that found that it helps to make more efficient sleep cycles and reduce wake after sleep onset, so it re reduces waking up at night. So omega threes are important in that. And I'll share one more. And again, there's several when I talk about all them back in the, you know, eat smart actually in the new cookbook as well.

DR. AMY SHAH: Okay.

SHAWN STEVENSON: I talk about them great with different foods and, another one would be a precursor to making melatonin, to making serotonin. Which is this precursor, which is tryptophan. All right. And so tryptophan, a lot of people think just Turkey or like thanksgiving, but there's a ton of different foods you can get tryptophan in as well. And, so, but again, if you're deficient in the precursors that help to make your neurotransmitters and hormones like serotonin and melatonin, your body's just gonna struggle to make them. So having ample amounts of tryptophan, omega threes, vitamin C will all be helpful in a previously quality. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Okay. What's number three? 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Oh, this is so much. Okay. 

DR. AMY SHAH: If there is three, there would just be two. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: I'll tell you what, but this number three for me is what controls the other two. All right. And it's focusing on our relationships.

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. Connection. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, that's really what it is because yeah, the mechanism that he identified, you know, my, my friend colleague from Harvard is to help to metabolize stress, but something that I've identified. I know we're gonna have data to affirm this, is that our relationship con, our relationships control what we eat. Huge influence on what we're eating because our relationships are, are exposure. Right? So many things that I didn't know were food or that I know is food. Were because of the relationships that I have that introduce those things and that goes on. We think that as adults we are not subject to peer pressure.

We are just big adult, you know, tweens, you know? Yeah. Like we're still heavily influenced by the people in our lives. The same thing, you know, with our choices and you know, exercise. The same thing with our sleep habits are heavily, my wife is the biggest factor in my sleep. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: All right. And then we don't talk about this stuff enough. So that's really, for me, what it is, is very practical. Our relationships have a huge influence over every other health factor that we can consider. So focusing on building healthy social bonds. And a big question is, how the hell do we do that? 

DR. AMY SHAH: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: A good first step is just scheduling time and making sacred time for you to have meals with people that you care about through the week. You know that minimum effective dose in the research, three meals a week, right? So make it sacred. Put on your calendar, like you put everything else, you know, you got family dinner, you know, maybe it's Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, whatever the case might be, or brunch on Sunday, or you schedule the dinner with your friends. You know, you get everybody together for a Saturday, whatever, Saturday lunch or something, and, um, make it sacred because not only are you going to get. All the benefits that we're talking about. But when you're doing that, there's so many other benefits that come along with, you know, having that quality time with people that you care about.

DR. AMY SHAH: I think that's so, so important. I think people don't put that number three. I think they would expect you to say maybe number one and number two, but number three is still really, really surprising to people. I could go on and on, but we have so much more to talk about. We're gonna have you on again. So appreciative of you and like I said. I can't thank you enough for all the good advice that you've been giving me over the years, and, I can always call you up and send you, you send me these long voice memos that it's like, it's like a, it's like a podcast and I get to hear what you have to say about the topic. And so many times when we've connected over meals, it's, or at least a time that we did it was so special. So I wanna thank you so much for being on and we will have you on again. Thanks. Awesome. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: This was awesome. I appreciate you. 

DR. AMY SHAH: Thank you. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Thank you so much for tuning into this special episode. I hope that you got a lot of value out of this. Definitely check out, save yourself with Dr. Amy Shah wherever you get your podcast or of course you could check it out on YouTube as well. I'm so grateful to have amazing, dedicated friends in this field of health and wellness who are changing the game, changing the paradigm. We're fed up. Enough is enough. We're creating real cultural change. It's happening right now, but it's not gonna happen. Without some turbulence as you're lifting off and trying to get everything in flight and get to where we need to be some turbulence, but that turbulence can be fortified and we can make this process more graceful by us working together, and that's what this is all about.

So if you got a lot of value outta this, please share it with somebody that you care about. Of course, you could share it on social media, Facebook, Instagram, X. Wherever you like to hang out on your socials, share this out. And of course you can send this directly from the podcast app that you're listening on, send it to somebody that you care about to empower them today. We got some amazing masterclasses and world-class guests come your way very, very soon. So make sure to stay tuned. Take care, have an amazing day and I'll talk with you soon. And for more after the show, make sure to head over to the model health show.com. That's where you can find all of the show notes.

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