SHAWN STEVENSON: I cannot begin to tell you how excited I am about this episode. It isn't often that an entirely new revelation happens in the field of health and fitness, and that's what you're getting access to today. We've got one of the leading scientists and researchers in the world on today's episode, and he's going to be sharing some mind blowing insights about bio gravitational medicine, alright? Again, I cannot put this into words how powerful this episode is and looking at our body's relationship to gravity and how it affects all aspects of our health. Our special guest is a leading gastroenterologist. And so what really transitioned his career into understanding this relationship with Gravity has to do with his association, with our gut health, with our gastrointestinal health.

And so he's gonna be sharing some paradigm shifting insights about our gut health and hiss relationship to gravity, as well as our microbiome. All of this incredible cascade of microbes that live within our bodies and on our bodies, trillions and trillions of bacteria, and their relationship with gravity and how it actually helps to keep us upright, alright? I'm telling you, this is so profound. And not to mention the relationship, this bio gravitational medicine implementation, when it comes to our muscular function, the health of our cardiovascular system, you're gonna look at your cardiovascular system in an entirely new way. And not only that, it's gonna be just like, oh, that's why it's like that.

Are you gonna have moments like that? And so again, I'm so grateful to be able to share this with you today. It's just adding another layer of empowerment, of insight, of understanding our bodies and our relationship in this incredible world that we're living in, this incredible solar system, and how we're a part of all of this. And not only that, we're not just looking at the physical relationship. We're also gonna be looking at how gravity deeply impacts our mental health. What's happening with our experience of emotion is deeply and profoundly related to our relationship with gravity. And so be ready to learn some life-changing information.

And of course, you're gonna learn how do you implement some strategies to make you more gravity resilient. We're gonna be talking about a few of those throughout the episode, but especially to close out this episode, you're gonna get a masterclass in this and so many science backed ways that we can utilize this emerging paradigm of bio gravitational medicine and fitness to our advantage. And one thing to consider before we get to our special guest, him being a gastroenterologist, he deals with our association with food and digestion, assimilation, elimination. And if we understand even what we're eating can give us a feeling of being weighed down, right? Or we can eat things that really make us feel light and energetic, right?

Have you heard the term a light meal? Right? So there are these things in lexicon we don't really think about. But they're deeply connected. And so I've got a question for you. Have you ever thought about why we seek out the foods that we seek? We are dealing with this intimate interconnection, this intermingling of all these different sensations and desires. And of course, in some instances, rewards. This is why we have the chemistry that we have, is to drive us to seek out certain things. Now, of course, in our environment today, we can get exposures, we can get things in our system that kind of throw off that communication, alright? Namely in the paradigm of ultra processed foods can throw off this craving communication center, this aite regulating network in our brain.

But did you know that one of the key drivers of increased cravings and food seeking behaviors have to do with electrolyte deficiencies. In fact, a study cited in the journal nutrients uncovered that increasing dietary potassium has one of the strongest correlations of decreasing body mass index of all nutrients studied, and it has a lot to do with its satiating effects. While an analysis published in the Journal of Nutrition and Internal Medicine demonstrates that magnesium suppresses hunger, lowers food intake, and reduces body weight, the most probable mechanism is through magnesium stimulating something called cholecystokinin, which plays an important inhibitory role in the control of feeding behavior.

The emerging science is showing that there are three key electrolytes that are really operating to regulate our appetite and seeking behavior, our food seeking behavior, and those electrolytes are magnesium, potassium, and sodium. And dialing in the optimal ratios are really a powerful key in regulating our appetite, but also in our cognitive performance and our immune system function and our metabolic health and so much more. So absolutely be proactive about eating foods that are rich in these key electrolytes. And also, this is yet another great reason to utilize the very best electrolytes supplement in the world that honed in on optimal ratios of those three key electrolytes. These electrolytes are being utilized by team USA weightlifting by major sports teams in the N-F-L, M-L-B, N-B-A.

The list goes on and on and on. It's taken over and I'm talking about the incredible electrolytes from LMNT. Go to drinkLMNT.com/model. That's drink LMN t.com/model. There's no artificial colors, no added sugar. And again, the very best optimized ratios of these three key electrolytes for better cognitive function sports performance. And just to feel your very best. And right now with every purchase of electrolytes, you're gonna receive a free sample pack to try out two packs of each of their four most popular drink flavors. This was by demand. People are like, oh, I wanna try this. I wanna try. And so instead of people bickering about who gets to try the watermelon flavor or the raspberry flavor, there's two of each.

Alright. So you get to try them all out. And by the way, my favorite right now, the summer bunnies. All right, summer. As of this recording, summer has came to le fin. All right? It's come to an end. It was supposed to be just for the summer. The lemonade salt. The lemonade salt. It hit the streets and it went crazy. Quickly became my favorite, especially after sweating being out, whether it's a workout out hooping, having the lemonade salt with some eyes. Oh my goodness gracious. It was, it was phenomenal, and I was not looking forward to it, coming to an end for the summer. But here's the great news, lemonade salt is here to stay by demand of the people. Lemonade salt is now available all the time, so again, go to drinklmnt.com/model to take advantage of this right now. Definitely try out the lemonade salt if you haven't already. It's definitely my favorite right now. Again, that's drinklmnt.com/model. And now let's get to the Apple Podcast review of the week. 

ITUNES REVIEW: Another five star review titled Such Important Information by CWYM rhonda. Thank you Shawn for all your work advocating for kids and families. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Thank you so much for leaving that review over on Apple Podcast. It really does mean a lot, and this is especially important for me and you know, again, we're gonna continue to bring on world-leading experts in the domain of pediatrics and just overall family wellness. It's something that really helps to get me up in the morning is to, to do whatever is necessary to create a healthier world for our children and for future generations. But I'll tell you this, it is something that has been a struggle because a lot of these algorithms. And this is real talk. They don't love it when you are talking about kids' health.

And so whether it's like YouTube or sometimes social media platform, some stuff can peek through, but just in general, all the other health information tends to spread, right very well. But when it comes to kids health and health education. And so this can deter creators from creating information and sharing information around this unless they're deeply passionate about it and that's why they're doing the work. And so it really does mean a lot to get that feedback and you know, we've gotta do whatever's necessary for our families and the power really is in our hands. And so I really do appreciate that. If you had to do so, please pop over to Apple Podcast, leave a review for the show. And now let's get to our special guest and topic of the day.

Dr. Brennan Spiegel is a physician, professor of medicine and research scientist. At Cedars Cyanide and UCLA, his research explores how emotion, physical experience, and the mind body connection shape health and how innovations like virtual reality and bio gravitational medicine can support healing and overall wellbeing. Dr. Spiegel has published over 300 peer-reviewed articles and written widely acclaimed books that bridge science, technology and the human experience. He's been featured all over major media, including in the New York Times, wall Street Journal, wired and The Atlantic, and he's here today to deliver a masterclass on how gravity influences our mind, body, and emotions in powerful ways. Let's dive in this conversation with the one and only Dr. Brennan Spiegel. Dr. Brennan Spiegel. Thank you for coming to join us today. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Hey, thanks for having me. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: We're gonna talk about some mindblowing ways that gravity's impacting our physical health and our mental health. Can you start off by talking about the relationship between gravity and our gut health?

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Oh, yeah. So gravity was here long before we were, and it'll be here long after we're gone. So it stands to reason that every part of your body, not just the gut, your bones, your muscles, your tendons, even your brain and your nervous system evolved to manage this fundamental force of physics. That's what we do right now as we're managing gravity. So I'm a gastroenterologist. I've thought a lot about the gut and it's relationship to gravity. And so when we stood up, which was only in the last part of our evolutionary history, we went from four-legged creatures with a center of gravity where our gut was kind of hanging down off of the spine, like ornaments off of a Christmas tree to being 90 degrees shifted and everything had to hang straight down.

And we evolved all of these suspension systems. We have suspension cables, basically in our belly, and it's holding up the sack of potatoes that you have, and I have. And some people are better at moving that sack of potatoes around than others. And it has everything to do with how strong you are, what you eat with the systems inside of your belly you're doing. We can unpack all of that. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah. Oh my gosh. Unpack is a good word for it. You know, just these are things that, as we were talking about, you know, even in our university education, we are taught a very mechanistic view of the human body and physiology. And in reality, there are all these invisible forces that we just don't consider in medicine, and that's changing. And thanks in large part to your work like this is absolutely blowing my mind. Every single aspect of our health, obviously you just mentioned this, we evolved in this environment and our bodies become tempered to this environment in ways that we don't even think of as we're sitting here, we are dealing with gravity. And you even mentioned within the gut itself, the microbes.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: So our microbiome is having a huge moment right now, thankfully. How do our microbes get into this conversation as well? 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Oh man. Where to start? Okay, so just to unpack what you just said, you know, physics came first and biology came second. We are a product of this planet. Literally, we're standing on this rock, which has all these physical forces that were here long before the microbiome was here and long before we were here. And biology emerged in large part to stand up and stay up in the force of gravity itself. And when you give into gravity, our health suffers. So let's think about that from the microbiome for a second.

We probably emerged from the oceans life, probably came from the water in these deep sea hydrothermal vents. Hot, dark, gassy, sulfuric worlds where life first emerged. That's one of the leading theories. And in the ocean, gravity was there, but it wasn't very important 'cause we were kind of floating around and eventually life evolved and came on the land. Yeah, and then gravity hit us straight on and we needed pumps and tubes inside our body to circulate blood and oxygen. We needed a vestibular system to keep ourselves balanced, and it turned out we needed something else. We needed serotonin. And serotonin, most people think of as a mood elevator, and we'll talk about that, but it's actually a gravity management substance.

And do you know where we get our serotonin from? The microbiome? So we have our own hydrothermal vent, another hot, dark, gassy sulfuric world. It's the gut and the microbiome hitched a ride on us inside of our body as we came out of the oceans, and we gave them the ability to move around the earth and they gave us the ability to literally move, by giving us serotonin. And so it goes really deep as we start getting into this evolutionary history. And then what does it mean for our diet and our lives? And we can get into all that stuff. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah. Oh, so fascinating. So fascinating. So these microbes are, of course, this is symbiotic relationship making things in us for us. And as you just mentioned, this is a revelation to be able to stand up against gravity. This is the capacity of serotonin. We, again, just tend to look at it like this kind of feel good.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Neurotransmitter slash hormone, but it's so much more than that. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes. So serotonin is a mood elevator. And even just think about that. Elevator is up when we're, we're high. When you take psychedelics, psychedelics explode, serotonin in your brain, and you literally feel high. You literally feel buoyant like you're floating. So there is a neuropsychology to gravity too. 

When you're depressed, you're down. You feel like gravity's pulling too hard on your body. You can't get up outta bed. You're exhausted. You look down at your toes, your body language is slumped over, and we can talk about that too. This is also serotonergic, but the serotonin in the gut that comes from those micro, those trillions of organisms living in us, helps prime all the pumps and tubes in your body.

You and I would be flacid sacks on the ground right now like a baby. A baby has not colonized its gut microbiome yet it has very little serotonin, and as a result, it's not able to move very, very well against gravity. But as we build our microbiome, we generate serotonin. It primes your cardiovascular system, your lymphatic system. There's something called the barrow receptor reflex, which all of us have to keep us from passing out. Little sensors inside your major blood vessels that measure pressure. And all of this works together in large part because serotonin's effects across the entire body, and we can go into even more examples, helps you stand up to its force.

SHAWN STEVENSON: That's remarkable. I want to circle back to the structure of the gut itself. And reading your book, I really got it. I got things at a different level. Even how elegantly placed everything is with the gastrointestinal tract. I really saw and understood that it's designed to resist gravity, right? But you have seen also in your work as a physician how issues with gravity can impact people's gut health. Can you talk a little bit about that connection? 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah. I mean, sometimes it's easiest to tell a story. A couple months ago I saw a patient in my clinic, a young woman who had been diagnosed with irritable bowel syndrome IBS, which is a very common condition. And she had recurrent abdominal pain, bloating, discomfort, and no one had really been able to figure out if what to do about it. So I went in and saw her after my student had seen her, and I always shake my patient's hand and I shook her hand and I noticed right away that her wrist was clicky. A little extra clickiness.

You may have shaken somebody's hand and noticed it clicked a little bit. Well, for a doctor, that's a clinical clue, and it was already the first sign in my mind that there may be a gravity problem here because the next thing I asked her to do after introducing myself, I asked her, can you bend your pinky back for me? How far back does it go? Now I can only bend my pinky 90 degrees. She went back farther. I asked her, can you take your thumb and move it to your forearm and touch your forearm? I can't do that. She easily did it. Can you touch the ground without bending your knees easily? She also was double jointed in her elbows.

She had very flexible joints. Well, it turns out that if your joints are flexible, the insides are flexible too. And I decided to do an X-ray first with her lying flat, then standing up and her sack of potatoes, right? That intestinal system literally collapsed into her pelvis. When she stood up, she had gravity intolerance. Turns out she had a condition called ER's Downlow syndrome, which is more common than people realize, and people who have very flexible joints sometimes get stomach pains, and what they're experiencing is gravity intolerance. They also get lightheaded and dizzy when they stand up too quickly. There the issue is collagen, which is a structural protein that helps us stand up to the force of gravity, and with these conditions. It's a little bit abnormal, the collagen, and this can lead to forms of gravity intolerance. So we diagnosed her right there from shaking her hand. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Hmm. Wow. That's fascinating. So in a case like that, what can you do? 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL:  Yeah, so once you realize, and you can see the picture so obvious that the gut literally like collapses down, you realize, well, what's gonna help with this strength training for starters, abdominal activity, also something called hypo oppressive exercises where you suck your belly in and like you're pulling up that sack of potatoes into your chest. Hold it, relax, pull it up again. And what you're doing is you're not only working out your anterior abs, but all of what I call the tensity systems inside of that sack of potatoes, that suspension system is a tensile integrity system, tensegrity.

This is the connection points between the systems. We always talk about the individual organs, but we rarely talk about where they come together, the seams of the body. And exercise like hypo oppressive activities help strengthen those seams, so that works. Swimming is great. It's a horizontal activity, and these are just a few examples of how we approach a patient like this to help strengthen their ability to stand up to gravity. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah, it was remarkable to see, because again, it clicked for me like how often folks with a wide range of gut issues also have low back pain.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes, right.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Talk about that a little bit. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: So, you know, the back I talked about earlier, how we stood up as humans we're two legged creatures, and there are advantages to that. One advantage is we can get up high and c another is that we can run very long distances because we can breathe at whatever rate we want to 'cause we don't have an or organ sloshing back and forth against our diaphragm. But the disadvantage is our center of gravity is very narrow and high, which is why we fall down a lot easily, we fall down, you know, you don't see giraffes like collapsing in the middle of the African planes. Like we fall down a lot as we get older because our center of gravity is so high. Now what does that have to do with the gut?

Well, the spine, if I'll do it right now, you sit up straight is a chassis that is holding up the abdominal cavity. And when you sit up straight and you move your shoulders back, you straighten your spine, you lift up your diaphragm. It's like a marionette on strings. If the strings are tight, the marionette comes up. But if the strings come down or are too stretchy, like with ER's, downlow syndrome, the marionette collapses. Back pain is a sign that you're giving into gravity. Either the structure of the spine is breaking down, or the muscles, the anti-gravity muscles on either side of the spine are not strong enough, and you lift that abdominal sack because the pulley system connects right around L four, right around your lumbar spine.

So you literally need to pull, stand up straight to open it up, and when the gut opens up, it moves better, it digests better. The last thing you should do if you're, if you have digestive issues, is lie down flat in a bed for days and days like we do in a nursing home or in a hospital where people give into gravity, they get bowel paralysis. So, you know, it goes on and on. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah. Yeah. So this is one of the most. Yeah. Market examples of movement as medicine. Right. Especially, again, being in those circumstances. You also shared the story in the book with your mother-in-law.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And being in a nursing home and just seeing progressively worse gastrointestinal issues. As you know, people are being kind of relegated to lying down a lot of the day, and so having movement as medicine, at least getting up and walking around, it's it's exercise. It's exercise that we see kind of superficially, but we're really exercising within gravity as well. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: That's it. So our relationship to gravity is like a fish to water. The fish is designed to survive and thrive and move through this aqueous, buoyant world that it's in. I don't think it knows it's in water, but it's, that's what it's doing. We are the same way with gravity. We are designed to survive and thrive in a world of gravity. And the better you do it, the more you engage with it, the stronger your body becomes and the easier it is to stand up to it.

And I think about where we are right now. 200 years ago, this building wasn't here. There were very few buildings here. There was Chaparral, there were some farms. There were people standing up to the force of gravity, strong, thin, working their asses off to survive. And that was 200 years ago. What about 2000 years ago, 10,000 years ago. All of human history was about fighting gravity, standing up to it mentally and physically. And now we have regressed. We literally are giving into gravity mentally and physically, and we have to stop that. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: This is a great segue because speaking of about 200 years ago, in honor of this episode, I just watched rewatched John Carter with my youngest son last night on Disney Plus. Shout out to John Carter. And so this was one of those big budget films Disney poured a lot of money into. It's based on a series of books. And this former soldier, right from about, you know, 200 years ago he happened upon a portal he was in. He was seeking treasure, essentially, but he happened upon this portal that delivered him, and I'm not gonna give away the punchline, like how it happened, but it, it, it has some basis in science, right?

But it's still science fiction. But this portal delivers him right to Mars. And he spent his entire life battling here and literally battling just, not just gravity, but battling people within Gravity. And so once he lands on Mars, his entire physiology, his muscles, his ligaments, his tendons, his cardiovascular system, his nervous system had all been training against Gravity.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: For his entire lifetime. And when he lands on Mars, even trying to take that first step, he's so explosive. He flies off.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: He's a superhero.

SHAWN STEVENSON: He's a superhero, essentially. And this is an express idea or delivery of what can happen once Gravity is displaced.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: That's right.

SHAWN STEVENSON: If you're training, because you don't know how strong you really are until that gravity's removed.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: That's right. So in the book, I talk about my own experiment. I call it Operation Gravitate, where I decided for eight straight weeks I was going weigh myself down. I'm on a bigger planet and I wanna see what it was gonna do. So it looked a little crazy. I wore almost like a tactical vest. Some people looked at me a little funny. It was a weighted vest, 20 pounds. I put 20 pounds on each ankle and I always use a standing desk at work. Plus I had a balance board. And my author photo in this book is me literally standing in my office looking all goofy. And I did it for eight weeks. Everywhere I went, I did it. Not the balance board part, but the the weights. And I, I'm a scientist, so I wanted to measure what was this gonna do to my strength. And so I measured my VO2, I measured my ability to walk up a standard flight of stairs. I measured my one mile time, running time, a whole bunch of other, how many squats I can do.

And what was amazing to me is not only did I get stronger, not only did my VO2 go up just by passively walking around with a weight dangling off of me, but I lost weight also. And I wasn't even intending for that to be part of it. And so it turns out that we have this system in our body called the gravitostat. It's like a thermostat for weight. And if you weight your body down, especially quickly, not progressively with through weight gain, the bones feel the tension and they tell your body like, gravity just got crazy strong. We gotta get lighter. And metabolic activity goes up and you can lose weight just by having pressure on your body.

Now you gotta do it safely. But that was the idea of in the movie, because I felt the buoyancy when I took off the weights. Like, you know, a baseball player on the OnDeck circle weighs down their bat and then when they get to home plate, they take the weight off and they're strong and fast 'cause in relation to where they were before, they're much stronger relatively.

SHAWN STEVENSON: This is so good, this is so good. And this is stuff, this is where we get very practical. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right. Practical and tactical. And I want to talk a little bit more about, you mentioned improvements in your VO2 max, like have you seen, well, of course you have. But if, can you share some of the insights that you've gained as far as gravity and association with like our cardiovascular health?

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah, so the cardiovascular system is an anti-gravity system because you have to pump five liters of blood up and down and up and down all day long. And you and I are again talking to each other, not passed out on the ground because you're getting enough oxygenated blood up to the control center, which is the farthest part from the ground. So what do you need to do to make sure you don't pass out? Well, you have to have muscle tone. You have to contract your legs a lot. You need to drink enough fluid. Adequate hydration is absolutely vital for life on this planet 'cause it helps you prime your pumps and tubes to get oxygen into your brain.

In fact, there's evidence that Alzheimer's disease and other forms of cognitive decline are in part associated with how much fluid you drink. If you get orthostatic, where you get lightheaded too easily. If your sodium levels are elevated, which means you're too dehydrated, those are associated with Alzheimer's disease. When you sleep at night, this is another reason why sleep is so important, you reperfuse your brain when you lie down. And there's some evidence that our ancestors who used to live in trees, when they finally got down from trees to ground and became horizontal at night, their intelligence exploded. And it may be because our brains finally were able to purge out amyloid and reperfuse with oxygen because we changed our relationship to gravity at nighttime. So these are just a few insights among many about how important the cardiovascular system is for gravity. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: It doesn't matter where we look, we're going to continuously see this relationship. That's right. That I'm so grateful to be able to essentially lift us up to seeing this in a broader way and delivering this message. So again, whether we're talking about our musculature, cardiovascular health, the health of our nervous system, our gut health, gravity is a huge part of this for us to now wake up and consider. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Mm-hmm. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: I wanna go to one of my favorite parts of the book, and you mentioned a little bit earlier, but feeling up.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right. Being, feeling lifted up, and you talk about feeling down as well. And this relationship between gravity and our mental health.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Let's talk about this a little bit. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: So we've been talking about the gut, and I'm a gastroenterologist, and I see a lot of patients who have chronic belly aches, gut feelings, we call them butterflies. And we try to find the reason. We do an x-ray, we do an endoscopy look, take pictures of the camera. We do blood tests, and we can't always find the cause. It dawned on me one day that there's something that causes that in every human, it's gravity. Think about last time you were on a roller coaster and you're falling, what happens?

Your belly lights up. You get butterflies in your belly. That's your body telling you that you're about to die. Because we're not supposed to fall 20 stories. We die. We ride rollercoasters because we're practicing our death, but we know we're safe. Some people though, do not wanna ride a rollercoaster. Especially some of my patients with IBS, they feel like they're falling all the time, metaphorically falling. It's like we have a GForce accelerometer in our belly that's telling you that's you're at risk. And some people are very sensitive accelerometers that fire off when they're in an airplane, when they're in an elevator that drops too quickly.

And here's the crazy thing, rock climbers like Alex Honnold, who scaled El Capitan without any ropes. He's the ultimate gravity fighter. He doesn't get any gut feelings dangling off the side of a cliff. When they look at his brain, he has the exact inverse brain. As somebody with irritable bowel syndrome or somebody with chronic anxiety or fibromyalgia, his amygdala, the emotion center in the middle of his brain is quiet.

Whereas people with chronic pain, chronic abdominal pain, their amygdala is on fire. And it's like a ventriloquist throwing its voice into the belly saying that you're falling. And if you get gut feelings a lot, you can rethink and realize, I am not falling. That is literally an illusion in my brain. And so we use virtual reality, for example, to reprocess these ideas. We use vagus nerve stimulation to reprocess your relationship cognitively to the force of gravity itself. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Got a quick break coming up. We'll be right back.

As the father of modern medicine, Hippocrates stated, all disease begins in the gut, and more than 2000 years later, we can be empowered to know that all health begins in the gut as well. So number one, we wanna avoid the things that absolutely trash our gut and our gut microbiome. Eat real wholesome foods that feel good for our bodies and with this emerging science regarding probiotics to yes, understand the value with probiotics, AKA for life, pro meaning for and biotic meaning life, but understanding that's just a snapshot of the incredible complexity of what's going on in our gut, supporting our gut health because our probiotics need prebiotics in order to flourish, in order to proliferate.

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SHAWN STEVENSON: So, this is already profound and we're very big on practicality and things that we can do. This is a very special, it's not a set of circumstances because we're in it regardless. But to become aware of it and to realize, I have some agency here in the book, you know, there's a chapter where it's titled Feeling Down and you give some Gravity Management insights. And so I want to ask you about some of these, and you have some cues in here, some things for us to consider, but you also kind of go through the science and why all of this is relevant. And I saw it when you really sat up top tall, it was another foot, you know, and you asked in the book, do you slump too much? And so let's talk about how we can feel better mentally in relation to what, what we're doing with our posture. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Absolutely. Your physical body determines your mental health. So if you think about our bodies and minds, we are. Gravity sensing machines. Remember I said that we evolved from this planet. We are a consequence of it. We are a consequence of the physics of our reality, and we stand up to it. And your body nervous system, every part of it is constantly taking in data from the physical reality of gravity processing it and the computer.

We compress the data down at each level more and more efficiently until all the data comes up in your head and you have this perception of the world around you. We call that consciousness. Consciousness itself, I believe, is in part or result of gravity, which is why AI is not conscious, but we can talk about that some other time. So practically speaking, your physical body is a gravity compression engine that is taking the data and informing your mind and what you do about that will determine your longevity. How you act in this planet, how you react to this planet, how you work within this, just the fish and water will determine how long and how well you live.

So practically, the position of your body is where you start if you stand up to gravity, okay? Gravity is not just about a pull down, it's actually a push up. That's what Einstein said, that's what relativity is. It is a push up. If you change your mindset and think about right now, the seat is pushing you up. We buoy ourselves into the world. We spring ourselves into the world, and that begins with standing up strong and long, and that will affect your mind and body. Now, I'm not saying this is the treatment for severe depression, but it's the very first step is to start retraining your physical reaction and response to this force of gravity.

SHAWN STEVENSON: This is profound. This got me thinking about also in the context of buoyancy, and we can mentally make ourselves heavier in water.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And sink to the bottom. Or we can change what's going on with our minds and literally float in its same water. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: So there's a neuroscientist in Australia named Lachlan Kent, and he 

and I are have become really close friends, and he developed this theory of mental gravity. And he figured out that there's a part of the brain called the insula, where you basically simulate gravity. It's like a physics engine that you have in your mind's eye. And you can right now close your eyes and imagine just floating up into the sky and you're not moving. You know your body's not moving, but you can feel a buoyancy inside of your mind's eye. Now we simulate that with virtual reality.

We take people in the hospital, for example, who are flat and sick and in pain. And we put them in virtual reality and we blast them off into the skies. And when we look at their body, we look at their heart rate, their heart rate variability, we look at their cortisol levels, their white blood cell count, it changes within 15 minutes. The mind and the body are connected. Of course they are. It's one continuous system sewn together from the inside, managing the force of gravity. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: As soon as I read that portion of the book, I immediately did it. I closed my eyes and I can literally feel myself floating off the ground.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right. And of course, on the other side, I could. Think about being pulled down and pulled to the earth and getting more and more grounded.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Or however you wanna look at it. You could feel like feeling down or pulled down versus I'm just getting more grounded and I can feel that that movement, this kind of internal movement. What was the term for this again? Mental gravity? 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Mental gravity. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah. Right. I can feel that. Yes. Once I became aware of it.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Right.

SHAWN STEVENSON: It's so powerful. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Well, just think about the words that we use in everyday language. We spoke about feeling high before you look up to the heavens for inspiration. Church steeples. Point to the ceilings, cathedral ceilings or high, or we feel down in the dumps. Down on my luck. Heaven is up. Hell is low. Up is good. Down is bad. By the way. We also get those butterflies when we fall in love. Why do we say we're falling in love? People feel sometimes an anxiety about that. It's also a vulnerable time, a milieu of positive and anxious emotions intermixed, and even that fires off the GForce accelerometer in some people. So it is hardwired into our neuropsychology that up as good and down as bad. We do not wanna fall. We wanna stand up to gravity. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: So, awesome. This is one of my favorite parts of the book, and we're gonna talk about this now. We're gonna dive into some bio gravitational medicine.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And specifically, my favorite chapter is How to Defy Gravity. And this is where the rubber meets the road. And some of these things, again, it just clicked in a different way and it added another layer of urgency and excitement for me to implement these things more purposefully. Many of them I do already, but just like, oh, now this is an ultimate unlock. So let's talk about some of these ways to defy gravity. And let's start off with the dead hang. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah. So the dead hang is an exercise that probably many of your listeners know about already, but now we're gonna think about it as a gravity management technique where you hang from a bar, make, get a solid, sturdy bar. You want your arms, your hands to be roughly shoulder width apart and just hang. Try not to touch your toes to the ground if you can, and let's see how long you can hang for your defined gravity in doing that. And it's really a measure of your overall ability as a singular mechanism, physically and emotionally to some degree to stand up to gravity. So it's a really good test. It's also a measure of grip strength.

Grip strength itself is a predictor of survival. You want your grip to be strong because that's a sign that the rest of your body is strong. And you're able to stand up to the force of gravity, and so dead hangs are great a little bit more every day. You might start with 10 seconds and you can't do it. Get to 20 seconds. If you can get up to a minute, you're doing pretty well. Get up to two minutes. That's solid. That's really good. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: What's the record? 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: The record I believe is one hour, and I wrote it in the book. I think it's.. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: An hour and 20 minutes, 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: 20 minutes and maybe 16 seconds, something like that. It used to be, I think it was like 16 minutes, which is already incredible. But to go for over an hour, that's not just a physical feat, that is mental gravity. That is you saying, I'm not going to give in to this force. I'm going to hold on for dear life. Literally for dear life, because you know what happens At the end of our life, gravity pulls us down and in some traditions we end up in a gravity box called a grave, which is a word derived from the word gravity. We return physically at least into the ground from which we sprang. Maybe emotionally we rise. But that's what I mean. And spiritually we may rise, but we hold, hold on for dear life. And that's really what the dead hang is teaching you. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: That's so beautiful. Let's talk about getting inverted. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah. Inversion therapy. So yoga is great. Yoga is great for many reasons in terms of gravity. Yoga is not just about getting bulked up. It's about that tensity system I talked about before. The connection points. Strengthening and zipping yourself up from the inside out. And inversion therapy allows you to reperfuse your brain. It allows you to get upper body strength. I have many patients who tell me that their stomach pain gets better when they flip themselves, whether it's through yoga or through tilt tables. So there are these tilt tables where you can hang like a bat. You don't even need to go all the way back, just a little bit back, get everything flowing in the opposite direction. 

Give the gut a little break, give everything a break. And there's evidence that this can really help for many people as well. So these are, these are interventions that very few doctors ever talk about. But yoga masters have known about this sort of thing for hundreds, thousands of years. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right, right. And it's just, this got me thinking about when I was a kid on the playground and hanging upside down from the monkey bars, for example, just hooking my legs, right? It's something that we kind of just have this inclination to do. And about 15 years ago, maybe 16 years ago, I can't believe this, so I was living in Ferguson, Missouri, Ferguson Flores in Missouri, and it was our first house. And my wife, I still, to this day, I gotta just give her so much props of letting me do this stuff that I was doing.

But I got a yoga swing, all right. And our house was not that big and basically took up. Half the living room. All right. And so it was this contraption, it has this base and then it kind of goes up like a bird cage. Yeah. And then hanging down are these different, I guess just like some, some material for you to sit in and you could flip yourself upside down and do all this kind of creative stuff. And so I would hang out in that all the time and, but when people came over and they saw in the living room, they're like, what are you guys into? Is freaky deaky what is this? But it was just again, learning from people around me, mentors about the value of getting inverted. So, and there's so many, again, you don't gotta get a yoga swing, but there are different creative ways. Even certain yoga poses can get you inverted. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah. And now you think about kids, and you were mentioning how when you're a kid you would hang as kids. We used to have sort of rough play. We would do somersaults, we would do cartwheels, roll down hills. What you're doing in those situations is you are training your body to understand the force of this planet and what's gonna happen to kids if they grow up lying in bed looking at screens. So it's worth thinking about this for a second because NASA has some answers. NASA did an experiment where it was in rats, but they had rats that were pregnant on the International Space Station, give birth to babies that were gestated in space where there was no gravity.

They then brought them back down to earth and these little rat pups literally couldn't even flip themselves over compared to those that were born and raised on the planet and they were, had much more capability to engage and move and flip themselves. So even the vestibular system in your brain is constantly learning. And just think when you're first evolving as a young person, as a child, your internal vestibular system and your brain, every part of your body, your nervous system is getting used to what it's like to stand up and be stable and strong on this planet. It's not just about how big you get, it's about how you orient yourself to the planet. And so inversion is all part of that. It's part of learning how to be like a person on this rock that we call Earth. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Amazing. Amazing. Another one of these insights for defying gravity building kind of this gravity resilience. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Hmm. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: And this one, something that I've got years of experience with, but it unlocked another reason how, why all the things hyperbaric oxygen therapy.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Talk about that one. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: So I think of this as a gravity intervention too. So if you go up in the atmosphere, the air gets thinner. And that's a result of gravity because gravity pulls the atmosphere down to sea level, like a blanket. And so as we get higher and higher, our physiology changes quite a bit. Serotonin, microbiome changes. All that changes. Hyperbaric, oxygen's like the opposite. That's like life on a bigger planet, where now the blanket of air is even packed tighter. And so what you're doing in a hyperbaric chamber is you're simulating for a short period of time life on a bigger planet. Now, obviously that has effects for oxygenation. The concentration of oxygen in the atmosphere would go up if we were on a bigger planet.

It's not safe to be in for a long time 'cause we didn't evolve for that kind of pressure. But for certain conditions, it is highly effective to use hyperbaric oxygen. As an everyday intervention, we have to be a bit more careful about using it 'cause there can be side effects, but it is ultimately a gravitational effect. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Mm. Wow. And this what we know now with tons of data on this, but like accelerating recovery. Improving the efficiency. One of the things that I saw was like long COVID improving symptoms related to lung issues.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Infections, that kind of stuff. And you know, there's all these different, all these different implementations, possibilities for it.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: But it really, for me, finally, just to click like this has to do with gravity. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: And by the way you mentioned long COVID. I do think that's a gravity and tolerance syndrome too. In part because COVID, I can damage the vagus nerve. And the vagus nerve is like an internal spigot for serotonin release in your body. If you have a well-functioning vagus nerve, it helps with digestion, it helps with mood, it helps with serotonin balance, and it also helps with blood pressure balance so that if you stand up too quickly, your blood pressure normally responds by keeping things perfused. But when the vagus nerve is damaged, you get lightheaded, get dizzy, get digestion issues, low mood, brain fog. Those are the symptoms of long COVID. So part of that condition may be in part related to gravity intolerance. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: This is a great transition to using breath work, breathing exercises.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And relationship again, unlocking another aha moment for us.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: The relationship with that and the vagus nerve. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Right. So when you take a deep breath in, in the upright stance like we are right now, it turns out it's the base of the lungs where oxygenation is maximized. Now that makes sense because if we're running, we need to oxygenate optimally, and gravity pulls the blood and the air, but especially the blood to the bottom of the lung, that's where your oxygenation is boosted. And when you take a deep breath in, the lungs suck up the blood and the return to the heart goes down. That means the heart rate has to be constantly slowing and speeding and slowing and speeding just a little bit. We call that heart rate variability to keep up with these two pumps, the diaphragm and lung and the heart.

And they're yoked together, working together in a symphony. And so what they're actually doing is managing gravity as they're moving the blood through the oxygenation system into the left ventricle boom, up into your brain. And so if you have a healthy vagus nerve, you are in a very fine way, fine tuning the relationship between those pumps to optimize your oxygenation, which is really vital when you need it. If you think about when you're really tired, you might yawn. What is a yawn doing? You know, take a deep breath in. Well, what you're actually doing is you're fighting gravity. You're taking a deep breath in, oxygenating at the base, pumping this oxygen laden load of blood into your left ventricle. Boom, right up into your head when you need it the most, to keep you awake just a little bit longer, to find a safe place to lie down and sleep if our ancestors had predators on their tails. So it all is about our evolutionary history on this planet. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yet another reason for us to do some breath work. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes. Breathing, whether it's Wim Hof breathing, which I sometimes do, or other forms of just slow deep breathing is not only strengthening the tensegrity, and elasticity of the lungs, but also just pumping the oxygen where it needs to go at the right time and place.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah, it just makes so much sense how our breathing can affect how we feel, of course, you know, and our emotions. That's so powerful. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: It's so accessible to everybody, and now if you think of it as a gravity management tool, it just changes your perception of why we're doing it. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Just to go back really quickly, we mentioned yoga in the context of inversion, getting those benefits, so some poses you mentioned, you know, headstands?

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Shoulder stands.

SHAWN STEVENSON: What about like downward dog? 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Downward dogs, a good one. Child's pose. Anything that gets your head below your heart so that the heart doesn't have to do as much work to pump up against gravity. Instead, you're leveraging gravity and the blood is going downhill and filling that brain up and perfusing it.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Amazing. Amazing. I finally get to ask somebody about float tanks.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: All right. So I did this back in the day as well. The first time I did a float tank. I made the mistake of I had just shaved first before I went. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Did the salt water? 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Man. But once that, once that kind of subside is just, it is a, it's like almost an out of this world experience.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You know, to, to say the least. So talk about float tanks. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Well, it's funny you mentioned that because the first, I'll put in quotes, float tank that I used was The Dead Sea in Israel. And I'm sitting there floating and I tell the story in the book, and it's this other worldly sense where the physics of the planet have been arrested for a moment, and you're just floating. And the sense of buoyancy changes your sense of embodiment. There's a distributed consciousness. Our consciousness is sort of confined to our physical body, but when you lose the sense of gravity for a moment, there's this, it's called oceanic consciousness where it spreads out across a plane. And that's what happens if you're really in flow on the Dead Sea or in a float tank.

And I'm sitting there floating and I open up my eyes and I see the desert sky, and I'm just sitting there thinking. I mean, am I even on this planet and is time passing at a different rate than I'm accustomed to? And by the way, at that moment, somebody splashed this hypertonic saline into my face and my eye burns and my mouth and nose burn. And then I'm like, okay, I'm out of that flow for now. But so it was for you, it was the shave. For me, it was somebody splashing my face. But the idea of float tanks is there's been functional MRI studies of the brain that show that you can literally change your perception of time itself. And it's the opposite of depression.

Depression is the sense of being pulled down, being fallen. If anxiety is falling like on a rollercoaster with gut feelings, depression is fallen. You've reached the bottom, gravity has taken you over, you are in a black hole. Time has stopped. But then flotation is the opposite. Your sense of time changes, you're buoyant. And in fact, it can be used for depression as an auxiliary therapy in addition to other forms of antidepressants. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: For folks who don't know what is a flow tank? 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah, I didn't even say that part. It's meant to simulate what happens in the Dead Sea and what you have is this hypertonic highly salinized fluid. So a lot of Epson salt gets poured into a tank that is warmed to body temperature. And then you sit in a beautiful room, not unlike this one, with the lights down a little bit, and you feel this sense of continuity because the water is at body temperature. It's almost like a physical extension of your body and you can create this sense of expansiveness because gravity's no longer working on your body. It's quite effective. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Hmm. This is amazing. Amazing. I'm gonna ask you about, and again, all of this is in your new book, and as of this recording, it's out. Everywhere books are sold. Everybody can pick up a copy of the new book, Pull. It's amazing. But I want to ask you, since we're talking about these different ways to defy gravity, this is one of your experiments and it's become a lot more, more popular suddenly. But this is something, again, it can give us another reason to do it, which is to utilize a weighted vest.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah. Yeah. So I mentioned earlier how I did that weighted vest exercise and I weighted myself down for eight weeks, and now you'll see a lot more people doing rucking, right, where they wear a weighted backpack or just some extra weights. I think we need a line of clothing that has some nice weights, maybe sewn into the, into the seams or something, somewhere that we can just have a little extra weight on our body. Kind of like that warmup circle where you weigh down the bat. And really all of this is doing is hacking your gravitostat, which I described earlier. It's telling your body that I need you to fight gravity.

But do it in a way that is safe, so you don't overwhelm your body. Obviously you don't want to have so much weight that you're hurting your back or you can't, you know, stand up to it. But we have to push ourselves a little bit to keep getting stronger. Gravity doesn't change, but our relationship to it does. As we get older, we get a little weaker. Our, we get pulled over, our spines get weaker, our bones get thinner. We have to stand up to it to survive. And wearing weighted vests is one way to help engage your relationship to gravity.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Incredible. Bio gravitational medicine, and in this chapter you talk about gravitates.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And you can basically be able to self-assess.

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Where, where you land in relationship to this stuff. Talk about that a little bit. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Well, I have a quiz now online and maybe we'll put the link to it. That is a gravitate quiz. All you do is you answer 16 questions. These are questions like, do you get lightheaded easily? If you stand up quickly, how long can you stand on one leg before you start to fall over or get wobbly? Do you get butterflies easily if you're in an airplane or, or an elevator? These kinds of questions. And it ends up mapping you to one of eight gravity types, and on the one hand, there's the gravity master. This is somebody who's strong. They have what I call gravity fortitude, strong muscles and bones, strong pumps and tubes. You stand up to the force of gravity. The second part is your gravity sensing. How sensitive are you to the force of gravity? What is your inner ear doing? For example, what is your nervous system, your proprioception systems that are keeping you balanced your center of gravity upright?

The third is the mental gravity, which we talked about, and depending upon your score, there are eight gravity types. The gravity master is strong in all three. The overwhelmed defender is weak in all three. I happen to be the alert stabilizer. That means that I am strong enough of body, I do run marathons. I also, thankfully, am mentally lifted enough that I'm not in the dumps right now. That can change, but where I fall down a little bit is the gravity sensing. My inner ear got thrown off early in life. I got hit in the head. I, I have a condition where the inner ear gets thrown off a little bit. I get dizzy sometimes. And so I need to know that so that I can retrain my vestibular system to be better aligned with the force of gravity. And so the report that the website gives you will show you what your type is and sort of what to do about it. But of course I always talk to a doctor too. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Amazing. Is there anything else you want people to know about Pull?

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: You know, I think what Pull is about is reassessing our role as human beings on this planet, physically, mentally, socially. It all kind of comes together when we look at it through this lens. And what it's doing is helping us better understand time tested interventions. We've everything we've been talking about today, this is not Woo science, this is stuff that's evidence-based, but we don't do enough of it. I'm hoping that when people think this way, they'll have a new motivation and a new understanding for why it's important to lose weight, why it's important to boost serotonin, why it's important to do dead hangs and get stronger. Why it's important to look after your mental health. These are all forms of gravity management and that's what this book's about.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah, this has been an absolute delight, game changer for me personally. I hope that everyone else feels the same. Pull is available everywhere. Books are sold. Favorite online retailers, favorite bookstores. Go get a copy today. Is there anywhere else where people can connect with you, follow your work? 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Yeah, I have a website and you can find the quiz on the website. It's my name, brennan spiegel md.com. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: Amazing. Thank you so much for sharing your genius with us. This has been awesome. 

DR. BRENNAN SPIEGEL: Hey man, it's awesome having being here. I really appreciate your interest. 

SHAWN STEVENSON: The one and only Dr. Brennan Spiegel. Everybody. Thank you so much for tuning into this episode today. I hope that you got a lot of value out of this. This is profound information. This is life-changing education, and you are at the forefront of this. Ideas like this are going to spread absolutely into the health and wellness space, into education, but you are hearing it here first. Share this. Be one of the early sharers of this information, and most importantly, one of the early adopters and appliers of this information.

You can of course, share this directly with somebody that you care about by sending this directly from the podcast app that you're listening on. Of course, you could pop over to the YouTube channel. Leave a comment, hang out with us there in the studio, and of course, subscribe to the Model Health Show on YouTube. We got some exclusive content there for you as well. Or take a screenshot, share this episode on social media. Share it like crazy. 

Share it out with your community. This is, again, something that a lot of people have no idea about. They've never heard about bio gravitational medicine or anything to do with this subject, and our special guest is one of the most published scientific authors and research scientists that is out there.

In this domain and in the domain of gastrointestinal health and virtual reality being used as medicine. He's a truly brilliant individual and so you can help to spread these very powerful ideas and help people to feel more empowered. We got some incredible masterclasses and world-class guests coming your way very, very soon, so make sure to stay tuned. Take care, have an amazing day, and I'll talk with you soon. And for more after the show, make sure to head over to the model health show.com. That's where you can find all of the show notes. You can find transcriptions videos for each episode. And if you've got a comment, you can leave me a comment there as well. And please make sure to head over to iTunes and leave us a rating to let everybody know that the show is awesome and I appreciate that so much and take care, I promise, to keep giving you more powerful, empowering, great content to help you transform your life. Thanks for tuning in.v