SHAWN STEVENSON: What do we do when we're faced with life's inevitable challenges? As the famous quote from Sylvester Stallone in Rocky says, "Life isn't all sunshine and rainbows." Even in that context of that epic movie, it's speaking through the lens of fighting is speaking through the lens of resilience, and finding a way through just being tough and facing all the stuff that's gonna come at you, and that is definitely one way to move through the world. Now, you're probably gonna end up with a lot of scar tissue and bullet wounds and gum stuck in your hair and all kinds of crazy stuff is gonna take place, but there is another way, there is another aspect of resiliency that isn't talked about, and it's going to complete this puzzle for you today, and it definitely did for me, it really opened my eyes to looking at another dimension of what it means to be resilient, because in our world today, more than ever, resiliency is one of the most powerful character traits that a person can have.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And I want to encourage that in you, but I also wanna let you know that it's okay to not be okay, and on this episode, we're gonna talk about what do you do when you are in the midst of a drama, you're in the midst of an incredibly trying time, you're in the midst of heartbreak, you're in the midst of... As our special guest calls it today, you're in the midst of the suck, you are just inundated with a very challenging time, what do we do? What do we do? How do we get from there to where we want to be, and what happens if we get trapped, sometimes we find ourselves living in that.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Sometimes we find ourselves traversing out of that too quickly and we don't even acknowledge how much we're hurt and actually do the work to heal ourselves in a truly efficacious and thoughtful way so that we don't keep falling back into that same pattern or finding ourselves with a big hole in our bullet proof vest, alright we wanna make sure that we're resilient moving forward, but that sometimes takes us to slow down and to actually acknowledge where we are, and so we're gonna talk about all that stuff today, and our special guest is just such a wealth of knowledge, and when you hear her story as well, it can give you some perspective on what you might be going through because sometimes even small sleights can really throw into a tizzy and sometimes hearing someone else's story can really give us perspective on, you know what, I do have power, if this person can go through this, I do have the power to find a way through this and to write a better story, but not just that, 

but having real world applicable tools is what she's providing 'cause she's been able to impact and serve and help thousands of people through her own practice, but in addition to that, now with bestselling books and being a renowned speaker, she's reaching hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people with this message, so I'm very excited to share this with you and I give you more tools.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Again, life's gonna happen, life be lifing, and life is gonna happen, and it's really about having a blueprint, having a map, because sometimes we are not given that culturally. We're just taught to be a certain way, and you deal with things a certain way, and for many of us, we live a life that pales in comparison to our potential, into our potential joy, our potential success, our potential health, because we're seeing life in the perspective that we were programmed with, and so I'm very grateful to be able to share these incredible insights with you to add to your superhero utility belt today.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Now, recently, I was having a conversation with one of my other incredible friends, who is an expert in personal development and psychology, psychiatry is actually a double board certified psychiatrist, Dr. Daniel Amen, he's been a great friend and mentor for many years, and he was sharing with me the importance of if you're in a struggle moment, if you are dealing with grief, if you're dealing with heartbreak, how important it is to make sure that we're getting our sleep because we're healing, not just physically, but our psychology, our brain is healing when we're sleeping, and so often when we're dealing with difficult times, for many of us, we bounce the other direction instead of resting and supporting our healing process and getting some sleep because of course, it's gonna be tough, depending on the circumstance that we're dealing with, but doing our best knowing that it's a priority, and knowing that's gonna help us to transition through the process, making it a must, if we're going through a tough time to make sure that we're focusing on high quality sleep, but also if times are good and we're just wanting to be at our best, we wanted to recover well from our training, we wanted to have top tier cognitive function, we wanna make sure they were investing in getting high quality sleep.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Now, unfortunately today, so many people were thinking through this lens, and we're thinking about getting good sleep, and maybe it's a struggle for us, we're thinking through the lens of pharmacology. What can I take? what can I take to improve my sleep, when in reality 9 times out of 10, we need to look at the environment, we need to look at our lifestyle practices around sleep, but when it comes to the nutritive and supplement side of this, and also, of course, there's pharmacology as well and pharmaceuticals that can be supportive. We don't wanna bounce to that so quickly, and a lot of different supplements out there, they're jumping right to taking melatonin, for example, and we have found in clinical trials that proactively taking melatonin too frequently and in too high of a dose, it can actually down regulate the receptor sites for melatonin in our bodies, our bodies can still produce melatonin on its own, that was one of the concerns is if we're taking this outside hormone... Because melatonin is a hormone, it's hormone therapy. We're going just because you can go and get it at the checkout aisle at the grocery store, you can get melatonin. It's a hormone, and it is in fact, hormone therapy, we need to be mindful of that.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Melatonin does a lot more things in our body than just help to regulate our sleep quality, and so just because a thing is normalized and popular does not mean that it is ideal. Now, there is absolutely a spot for melatonin supplementation, especially if it's in the right form, which there isn't just one form of melatonin, keep that in mind. But I would much rather see people doing things that are much more gentle, that are acting upon our nervous system, but also helping to support things like the health of our immune system and so many other things because funny enough, and little fun fact, our immune system has a lot to do with our sleep quality, there are certain aspects of our immune system in particular, certain cytokines that help to regulate and move us through certain phases of our sleep. Really remarkable, there's this two way connection between our sleep in our immune system, because our sleep quality also in of itself is a huge, huge determining factor on the health of our immune system, because even our immune cells need proper recovery in a way as well.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And now, with all of that being said, what I would recommend and what I've been utilizing for many, many years, and not only that, it's backed by centuries of documented use, but also we have a ton of peer-reviewed data today affirming its benefit for improving our sleep quality and so many aspects of our health, but it's not coming in like a blunt instrument forcing us to go to sleep, it's more so again, acting upon our nervous system and a study that was publish in the Journal of Pharmacology, Biochemistry and Behavior, found that the renowned medicinal mushroom called Reishi was able to significantly decrease sleep latency, meaning that it helps you to fall sleep faster, it increases overall sleep time, and it also increases non-REM deep sleep time as well, so it's a truly remarkable in and of itself and being supportive of sleep and I would recommend making this an evening routine if you have found that you've had some struggle with your sleep, or maybe you just want to give you sleep a little bit of a tune up, having a cup of Reishi an hour before bed, 90 minutes before bed as just part of your evening routine can be a really great adjunct.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And in addition, a new study titled “Exploration of the Anti-Insomnia Mechanism of Reishi”, looked at how Reishi impacts changes at the genetic level to bring about improved sleep quality. After their analysis, the researchers stated "Reishi mainly affects target genes in the pineal body, amygdala nucleus, prefrontal cortex, cerebellum and other regions which regulate rhythm related physiological processes." And to top things off, research published in a Journal of Pharmacological Sciences found that the polysaccharides in Reishi have extensive immunomodulating effects including promoting the function of antigen presenting cells, humoral immunity, and cellular immunity. It's amazing for our sleep and supporting the health of our immune system as well. There's only one place, one place to get a dual extracted beyond organic Reishi, and that is from Four Sigmatic.

SHAWN STEVENSON: So you're actually getting these compounds that are noted in these studies, you wanna make sure that it's actually there, because this is another truth about the industry in particular, not just supplements, but in particular, when it comes to medicinal mushrooms, a recent analysis found that many medicinal mushroom products don't even have the actual part of the mushroom that creates these therapeutic effects and Four Sigmatic goes above and beyond to make sure that you're actually getting the highest quality available. Go to foursigmatic.com/model, that's F-O-U-R-S-I-G-M-A-T-I-C.com/model. And you're gonna get 10% off store wide including their amazing Reishi Elixir, and you can utilize the Reishi whatever way that you enjoy as a standalone tea, you can add various sweeteners, I'd recommend a high quality honey or Stevia or some healthy fats, whatever the case might be, and also they have an incredible Reishi hot cocoa that you can utilize as well, so you can take advantage of the benefits of Reishi and organic cacao in that blend as well. So again, pop over to foursigmatic.com/model for 10% off store-wide, and now let's get the Apple Podcast review of the week.

ITUNES REVIEW: Another five-star review titled “Awesome” by Jesus1775. Just listened to my first episode as a new follower. The episode was a natural health for heart disease, and let me just say, it was awesome. It goes into great details and yet is still simple to understand, I already shared the episode with people I know. Great work.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Amazing, thank you so much for sharing that review over on Apple Podcast, I truly do appreciate that, and thank you so much for the shout on the particular content. Looking at heart disease, it is still the number one killer in the United States. And we need to get more education out there about the causative agents, of course, but what are some science backed things that we can do to reduce our risk, but also to reverse these conditions and to be empowered and to help our families to take control of their health. And now on that note, let's get to our special guest and topic of the day. Dr. Neeta Bhushan is a cosmetic dentist turned world renowned emotional health expert. She's written multiple best selling books, including her five time award winning book, 'That Sucked. Now, What?' She's also the founder of the Global Grid Institute. She's been featured everywhere, from Forbes to NBC, ABC News. The list goes on and on. She's traveled across 45 countries, studying human behavior and therapeutic psychology and brought all of her wisdom here for us today. Let's dive into this incredible conversation with Dr. Neeta Bhushan. Neeta, so good to see you. Thank you for coming to hang out with us.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Oh my gosh, it is such an honor to be here, being your energy, you're so a fam bro.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Let's go. That part. That part. I wanna ask you first and foremost, I know a lot of people right now are in the midst of a challenge in their life, and they're at some stage of it, and that's the cool thing about your work is like you've kind of dissected this into stages that felt really familiar, but whether or not somebody's in a moment of challenge or they have that challenge coming around the corner, you help me to redefine and think about resilience in a different way, so let's talk about that word in and of itself.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Yes. Wow, resilience. It's so good to be on this show because I feel like when people... And when anybody is thinking about resilience, it's okay I've got to be strong, I've gotta power through it! I feel like growing up, I would see the YouTube motivational videos of the guy punching in the dark lights, and we're powering through. And when you actually go to the bare bones roots of the word resilient... Well, in Latin, it's resilire and resilire means to bounce, to bounce back. So if we think about it, okay, to bounce means that, well, maybe we don't have to be so strong and tough, because if I were to take this glass right here, fill it up with water. And you might say, well, Neeta, it's strong. It's tough, it's tough. But if I were to take that glass and let it go on this wood floor, well, it's gonna shatter, it's gonna break maybe into 100 pieces, but if I were to take a basketball in my other hand or a bouncy ball, I've got two toddlers. The ones that you get from the birthday party and you take it and you start to feel into it.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Okay, it's got a little bit of give. It's got a little bit of balance. If I let that go, it's going to maybe bounce really low or balance really high, but it has the flexibility, it has the agility, and so should we be hard on ourselves then. And I think my definition of resilience, and of course, taking the Latin root word, and I talk about this in the book as well, is, well, yeah, it's not only to bounce back, but it's also to use it as a framework and kind of a trampoline where we can just... We can actually fly forward, but we can actually also sit in, what I like to call, sit in the suck, and maybe say, it's okay to not be okay, and I can give myself grace and I can give myself compassion.

SHAWN STEVENSON: It's okay to not be okay. That's something that probably both of us have experienced as our programming is that it's not okay, and so that's revolutionary in and of itself, and also this is what I'm seeing now in this stage of my life, and also just with the work that I've been doing and the people that I'm connected with is that folks are opening up more and sharing that they're not okay, that they're having moments of struggle, these are things that all happen behind closed doors, essentially, my mom, I never heard her talk like that, she just powered through that sh*t. And the outcomes from that, we're not good. And I wanna ask you about this because just kinda re-defining this and looking at this, where all the things. Because honestly, I felt like that resilience that I've been building, and even in the last few years, it was about standing for other people fighting, developing a shield of sorts to be tough, to be hard, to be able to power through things, but that is likely gonna end badly for me too, you know what I mean, but in this cultivating bolt, so yes, it is this capacity to be strong and a power through things, but also to cultivate this ability to be soft and to be okay with not being okay and to acknowledge when I'm in a process.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Right, and that we have different stages and seasons of life, and I think that a lot of times... And being as a female understanding more of I talk about the masculine and the feminine, but many times even this masculine route of, alright, I've gotta be the one that's there for everybody, and I'm the one that has to take care of everyone, but then I can't show emotion, because I grew up with my grandfather, my mom's dad, he served in World War II, he was in the military, and so he was very stoic and you would never see him break down, and he always had this essence of, alright, don't talk back to us, and this very... I have this very tiger parenting upbringing with dad's from India and mom's from the Philippines, and so there was never any grace, and I feel like we've shared a lot of this strife of adversity and challenge growing up, yet I think that as you are allowing yourself to sit in the discomfort, because being in that uncertainty of discomfort is actually... Maybe it's okay, maybe it's okay because sometimes maybe there's a physical... You pull your shoulder or you break your leg, you know you're not gonna be able to power through anything, you're gonna have to receive, lay back, lay down.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: And so I think so often we're so wired to bypass some of our emotions because it's like, oh, okay, this thing has happened, and I know I've been told I'm strong, I'm tough, but what if we can't appreciate our soft side, not that... We all have to be feminine, but that we can have more grace and patience with ourselves because our body needs to heal, and quite frankly, in the last few years, we've seen in obviously since COVID, our whole epidemic of our mental health challenges, and I think that there is a point where, yeah, it's actually okay to number one, acknowledge it, but my book aims to really talk about, well, let's actually feel into it. And what are we avoiding, feeling that we tend to mask with all of the to dos or with the things that we're trying to add to our plate or the other vices, which leads us to this downward spiral of not coming back to ourself.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Yeah. We tend to admire people who have that kind of stoic appearance, but the truth is, even the toughest gangster person, even Ice Cube for example, is jumping to my mind...

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Yes.

SHAWN STEVENSON: There's, when he's eating some cookies, he's not feeling tough, he's eating cookies like damn this cookie is good and a mother..., he's eating a cookie and he's laughing and he's hugging his kids.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: He's a soft teddy bear inside probably.

SHAWN STEVENSON: That's what I'm saying. And we all have these different aspects of ourselves, but because of our cultural conditioning, we tend to put ourselves into this one particular box, and I'm a big advocate now, again, is of acknowledging all parts of us, and also in particular, because we are very social species, we're social creatures, but part of that stoicism and being so tough and so resilient, it tends to cut us off from the support and the love, and all those things that can really add to our resilience that can add to our mission, that can actually make us a lot stronger.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Totally.

SHAWN STEVENSON: So you talked about... And by the way, if we're talking about resilience, you know a thing or 20 about going through some things, and you shared your story in your book, and it was really like a gut punch for me, just even tuning into some of the parts of the story that I didn't know, but you mentioned your parents, for example, and you had a really intense... I can't even imagine the experience with your parents and also your brother as well. Can you just talk a little bit about that? 

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Oh yeah, wooh. I think probably it's because it's become my life's work that I can now share both sides of resilience and resiliency, because most of my childhood was hallmarked by this idea of Neeta, you're resilient, Neeta, you're really strong. I was the oldest daughter and I had two younger brothers, and growing up in Chicago, melting pot, but my parents were immigrants, and so the idea of this Keeping Up with the Joneses, Coming to America for the American dream, all of the things... I feel like we were on this trajectory, and my parents, of course, instilled all the values of education and all of this, but I feel like I grew up really early because at 10 years old, I was a caretaker to my mom who worked really hard, but she got sick and she had breast cancer, but then that kind of shifted and changed where for those six years, she was in and out of hospitals, so six years of my adolescence, I mean, everyone would be going to the prom or their days or what not, and I'm going after school to the hospital to care for her, and she passed and transitioned when I was 16, but then a year later, when we're trying to begin our journey of healing, we would have my brother, who was...

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: I was a senior in high school and he was a sophomore. And he had an asthma attack, this was a year after my mom died. And they couldn't revive him and he had... His lungs collapsed over his heart, and so... And this was on my youngest brother's 12th birthday, and so I remember just going into full like... Now I have language for it, but my nervous system was just like a fight flight, like what... What is going on? And all you know was just, alright, I gotta power through this because I was the oldest and I had to be strong for my dad, who went into this, he spiraled into deep depression because as an Indian man, you're not... You're kind of almost ousted from society if you're like a widow, and so people just in the community didn't know how to deal, not just with one tragedy, but two... And then case in point, two years later, when I'm in college, we get this diagnosis from my dad, and he had stage four lung cancer...

SHAWN STEVENSON: My goodness.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: And my mom died of lung... Her cancer spread to her lungs, and in the esoteric or Chinese medicine, lungs are a sign of grief. My brother, he died of his lungs collapsing asthma attack, again, the Chinese medicine where a lot of the esoteric healing is all around, the grief of the lungs, my dad had lung cancer, and so at 19, I'm an orphan, I have to now take care of my youngest brother who was 14, and I'm in this tunnel and all I can imagine and just... I have this mantra in my head of what my dad would always remind me, "Neeta, you're strong. You got this. You're strong. You got this. So am like okay strong you got this So I'm entering my 20s and I'm like, alright, let's go. And in the book, I talk about having a chip on your shoulder because I sure had that. I didn't want anybody to pity us, I didn't want anybody to feel bad for us, and I'm like, alright, I'm gonna make my parents proud, and so I did all of the things... And it was one of the things that resiliency got me to my 20s, it got me to.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Yes, I did really well in school and became a cosmetic dentist, and all of the flashy things on the outside, but what I was struggling with was this internal like conflict of what am I actually... What is going on with my life? That in my personal life, for years, I would be attached to toxic relationships and toxic relationships over and over, and I was so afraid of being alone that I got married early on, and it happened to be a toxic relationship, but at the end of my 20s was when I would finally realize after I had the seven figure practice and I was the talk of the town to all of our community that look at her, she's so strong and look at what she's done with her life, but I was breaking down and I was spiritually dead, mentally, emotionally distraught.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: And I remember this because it was like December 31st, 2011. I feel like that's my awakening day, where I remember just having all the bells and whistles of my life, and I had a beautiful home and I was married, and I had to say three words because in my soul, I felt like I couldn't do it anymore. I couldn't lie, and I felt like I was lying to everyone around me, my family members, my brother, everyone that I was not okay. And so I said three words, I need help. And I was looking at the mirror in my bedroom, I need help, and it was literally the day that I left, I left that whole life, I left that marriage, and it started to unfold and unpack the decades worth of grief that I packed away in a closet under the rug, like we do.  I needed to shatter, like that glass, I needed to fully shatter so that I could pick the pieces up and come back to myself, and I feel like for a lot of people listening is... It's when you recognize that, fine, maybe we're... There are parts of us that are broken, but it's that Japanese Kintsugi saying of, they put gold where the cracks are, and it becomes this beautiful masterpiece of Kintsugi and Kintsugi art, it's a beautiful practice but that's where the healing and the growth is.

SHAWN STEVENSON: I love that analogy. And it's so crazy, we're already connected because I was gonna bring that up. Because in that culture, in a strange way, the damage is where the gold is gonna be placed and it makes it more valuable, and so this thing that might have been thrown away, being able to repair it in a sense, to give it a new shape, meaning in essence, but it really makes it more valuable, but we don't see that for ourselves, and sometimes we have a crack and then we'll just give up or just throw it all the way, when in reality, sometimes those cracks where the light shines in and also where we can add even more value and start to see the possibilities.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And this is one of the cool things about this framework because during these stages, and one of them you even mentioned like being able to start to see possibilities because especially when we're in to suck, it usually looks like everything is messed up, it's just all problems everywhere all the time. There's nothing good out here on these streets. So I would love if you could take us through this framework, it's five steps, and it's really profound, but it starts with stage one where again, there's a lot of people right now listening to this that are in this stage, and if we're not, if we've gone through this before, we probably recognize some of these different stages and where we are today, but also know that life is going to keep on handing us these often unexpected challenges, but we can start to see this opportunity, so let's go through these five stages.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Absolutely, so the first stage is like the fall. Something happened, you broke your shoulder, you got into a car accident, you found out your spouse was cheating on you, or you came home and you realized that their stuff was gone, for me, it was recognizing that oh wow, I no longer can be in this relationship, and so that's the fall, you feel hopeless, you might feel defeated, you might feel depressed, you might feel like I just lost in this uncertainty, and it might feel so completely unfamiliar, yet, then you get into the stage 2 which is the ignition. You're in the igniting phase, there is a fire under your belly, maybe it's after you get that medical diagnosis, and it's... Alright, am I going to do what I've been doing for a long time? Or am I gonna make the change? Am I gonna go and see that doctor? Am I gonna go change doctors, Am I gonna go see that therapist? Get some help. Say those three words, I need help, but there is something that is under your belly that's like, I can't go back to that pain because that pain is so big that I am going to step into an alternate version of myself that I didn't even now existed completely different.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: And so that's the stage 2, and Shawn, not everybody gets to that stage two, and they'll go back and go back maybe to that relationship 'cause they're not ready, but they'll go back into other forms of that suck or because it feels familiar and familiar feels good. Because unfamiliar is scary. But for those that are like, Alright, I gotta do something different. This is not helping my health, and so then we get into the rising stage, and for me, the rising stage was, alright, I got the restraining order, I'm staying on friends couches, I've shared this with my family, you are doing things that are completely out of your comfort zone, and you're asking for help. You're like a toddler that is learning to walk and you are wobbly, the ego, your ego is just like.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Surrender because I'm learning and I'm just embracing this newness, I don't know what's gonna happen, but I'm actually trusting in the feelings in this stage is you're starting to cultivate trust within yourself, you're starting to cultivate a little bit more confidence... Yes, you might be in this arena of the paradox that I like to call it, of where you still might be grieving the loss of your partner or the break up, or the friendship or the betrayal, but you're also kind of in this other dimension of...

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Alright, there's hope. There's faith, there's... I'm curious, I might be skeptical, but I'm curious about how this might play out, so you're kind of navigating new waters and you're okay being in the uncertainty, you're embracing it, and then we get into stage four, which is the magnifying stage, you've got a little pep in your step... Maybe you found a few friends at the gym because you've been going there for three months, you've got a trainer that you really enjoy or, I remember the first thing I did for myself was I took a stand-up comedy class at second city, shout out second city Chicago. Actually, it was improv first, and then stand-up comedy, because I was so afraid of public speaking. I was still a dentist, but I wanted to get myself out of my comfort level. It's kind of what I like to call this good stress, right.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Well, you're building a new skill I needed to recreate friends in a community that I just left. So for me, I'm like, okay, I mean, I got nothing to lose. I know one person in this and so, this was improv, but in the magnifying stage, you are saying yes to new possibilities, you're saying yes to go to a place that you've never visited before, you're saying yes to maybe pouring into yourself, taking a yoga teacher training or maybe doing that meditation, pouring back into you, and because you're doing it consistently, you're now starting to magnify and you are amplifying your own gifts, whatever that could be, and maybe you start to realize that, oh, I wanna pay it forward for somebody else, I wanna volunteer at the local shelter or do some charity work, because I feel like other people need to know about X-Y and Z that I've been through, or whatever, that feels whatever feels is right to you, but then we get into the fifth stage, which is the thriving stage and thriving.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Doesn't it mean that you're not gonna have a fall, thriving does not mean that will blast off into outer space thriving does not mean that we're just gonna be super heroes for life. No, thriving means that, Alright, you are so now solid and sovereign in yourself that, We have a saying in Hindi, “Log Kya Kahenge”, what will people say? You no longer care what other people or the outside noise will say you are doing things because it lights you up, you are also allowing for your own personal check-ins to say, ohhh, does this feel right? Should I go to this party? Should I actually stay in and do it for me, your boundaries are being more solid because you're pouring back into you and you're doing things because you wanna do them, not because of other people, and so... And when you're in a bind, again, you're okay with asking for help, you're okay with having a community of support, like coaches, therapists, doctors, healers, whatever, to actually pour back into you...

SHAWN STEVENSON: It sounds so obvious. It sounds so obvious to do that, but I think that a lot of times we don't have a map, especially if we have certain cultural programming to where, again, we're just a certain way and this is how it is, but being able to articulate these stages and to know that we're in the process and of itself is so helpful, and there's one in particular question, because I think... And I'm just throwing this out there. You're the expert on this. I would imagine the toughest stage would be to get from the initial stage of the fall to the ignition, so that's what I'm just kind of being able to pull out of this. And in the book, you said this, and I'm just gonna quote you directly you said, "there's only so much change we can create while looking at the past, though past struggles and experiences give us strength and resilience, I truly believe we need to be looking and navigating forward in order to fly." So this is the fly forward framework, these five steps. So my question is, how do we get from the fall to the ignition, how do we actually get there? 

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: That's big, because like I shared, that is the hardest... It's one of the reasons why most people will fail on their New Year's resolutions, I will fail on their promises to themselves or the new diets, and because change is hard, change is really difficult, especially when it's scary, especially when it's uncertain, especially when you feel like the familiarity of a toxic relationship feels so much more comforting or the dysfunction that you have in a toxic friendship is so much more comforting than stepping out into the unknown because you don't know what's gonna happen, you don't know if you're gonna be so successful in that business adventure or so successful in the next thing that you're doing, that you'd rather play small that we... 'cause that's what you know, that's what you've been knowing, that's a safe spot for us, and our nervous systems just wanna feel safe, we're not wired to take that quantum leap, however, there's gotta be... And the pain has to be so big for us in order to say, I don't want that life anymore, that's been causing me so much pain, that I'd rather take the risk because there is something igniting me and I can't go back to where I was going, because I gotta do something I've never done.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: And that's where your trust comes in. That's where what we call your intuition, something else calls it your angels or whatever. If you have a belief in a higher power that's where something else comes in. For me it was saying those three words out loud and recognizing and seeing the awareness of oh okay I've been doing this. I've been seeing this pattern and this I talk about radical self awareness in the book as well and when we're not... When we're doing things blindly and we're just kind of oblivious to our environment. We're not paying attention to all of the subtleties. But when we're strengthening our radical self awareness we're like oh okay I can see my pattern here. I can see where I picked that person. I can see where I'm in the victim. I've got a pity party for one. But it takes courage, it takes bravery. And honestly it takes people who really also believe in you. I think many times we at least can count on one other person to say that's not really you. I know that there's something else in you. And if you're listening to this and you're like I don't know if I have that person well maybe that person is you. And we just got to look in the mirror. And that's why mirror work, mirror work is a thing. It's a thing and psychologists have even talked about this.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: I think Mary or Amy Cuddy, the TEDx speaker, was talking about how you stand and do those power poses in the mirror to cultivate your own inner confidence so that you can actually be your own inner superhero and fly forward. But it takes that certain level of that awareness to say okay I am going to do something different. I'm going to do something different that I've never done before.

SHAWN STEVENSON: This is really hitting me different right now. I just got a call yesterday from somebody who I've known since I was a kid and we've had different trajectories of our lives mostly when... After I graduated high school I went to college and that whole thing and I was just trying to figure things out to write a new story for my family and that whole thing. And this person has been there along the way because they're kind of like an extended family member. And little did I know they always knew even when this wasn't until I was an adult that they shared with me even when I was a kid they were a little bit older than me that I was exceptional. I was going to do something special. I didn't know I was just trying to make it out of the environment that we're in. But they called me yesterday and they shared some news that they had been going not just going back but had gone back to this toxic relationship that I thought that they had separated from about 15 years ago and I thought that they were living somewhere else but that uncertainty and also they share with me that when they initially left they didn't want when they went back because of the story they told themselves which has a lot to do with certainty and just being able just to make it to get by to try to achieve my goal so that I then can tell you how I made it.

SHAWN STEVENSON: She shared with me that she didn't want to tell me because she knew that I would challenge her on that. She knew that I would articulate that there were so many other possibilities and ways that she could navigate the situation than going back. And so little did I know all of the conversations we had this last 15 years that that's where she's been. Wow. And the story's a little bit different. They might share a different section of the house or whatever. It's convenience but just the fact that you're there and the impact that that's going to have on your kids on your extended family members our relationship. But it's so interesting you mentioning having that person to see the best in you to challenge you but lovingly because there is a way to go about this stuff.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Of course.

SHAWN STEVENSON: But having access to somebody like that is such a blessing because for you and I for many of us we don't have that and we seek it out whether that's through a podcast whether that's through going to events whatever the case might be we look for a mentor who's going to speak to the highest in us. So thank you for mentioning this because I think that this is a big possible ingredient for getting from the fall into the ignition is being able to reach out to people around you who really value you and who want better for you truly. And this isn't about any kind of lower tier selfishness or envy or any of that stuff. They just really want to see you succeed and they see the greatness in you and actually opening yourself up and sharing. But you said and this is what I want to ask you about. When we are in that victim mindset we tend to latch onto that. That's our identity and we shut ourselves off from that possibility. So let's talk a little bit more about that victim mentality.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Oh Yeah. I mean the victim mentality keeps us safe. It's our ego. It's like alright everything else is scary. And so to be and in … just in the suck of alright everything bad keeps happening to me I always pick the partners that are not the best. I don't think there's anything out there for me or the business things that I keep doing are... They don't go anywhere. And so we kind of stay in this low frequency or low vibe. It's like this low hanging fruit. And because it becomes then an identity we can then complain to other people and get their sympathy. And it can be something that we can then share. And we don't have to take personal responsibility because, oh wow look at me. So when do we then get to change the narrative? We can be stuck. And this is what happens for a lot of people. I feel like they get stuck in this suck or this period of where I can't even take any action because nothing is going on. Or you're in this other end of the boat where you're like I'm going to power through and nothing's going to tear me down. Nothing. There's no way. And so the other half of people …  they keep going until they burn out or until the universe God or something actually happens. They get a sickness or an illness where they have to slow down.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: But the majority of people who are in this victim spiral and in mindset it's safe to be there. It's safe to not take any action. It's safe to not try that new business. It's safe to not put yourself and try to date because for fear of ooh maybe I'll get rejected and what does that rejection mean about the parts of me that don't feel good enough or the parts of me that don't feel worthy of love and that I have to confront that and to confront those deeper layers of those feelings. It's hard 'cause who wants to confront worthiness and where did we feel unworthy growing up or in our relationships where we just pick whatever person that walks into our life who may not treat us well but then we're still going back there for that same dysfunction and toxicity because we know it's safe.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You also talk about looking at where we pick up some of these ideas from that become our belief system, how we see the world and a lot of issues. I think that this is one of the biggest epidemics is a lack of a sense of worthiness. And when we don't feel worthy of love, of health, of success or whatever the case might be we can literally self sabotage a lot. And sometimes we pick this up because we're seeking approval that we never got. And so it's like being able to have some introspection. You've got a lot of great exercises in the book as well to look at where did I pick this thing up from where I don't have a sense of worthiness? What approval have I been seeking? And I'm looking for this approval from my mother who's no longer alive and this is literally something that I can't get approval from but I'm carrying this and it's helped to create my victim mindset. This is already super helpful but I want to dig in more because again being in that struggle zone in the suck itself is very difficult to get out of. As you said this is a time when a lot of us turn back and a lot of us give up. But the crazy thing is certain times there's a glimpse of light and we start to maybe try to start the ignition but it's like it's not really starting.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And I want to ask you about a particular exercise which is literally writing down all of the f*cked up things that have happened in your life writing them down write everything bad that has happened to you in your life write it all down. But there's another part of that as well. Let's talk about that exercise.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Oh wow. So I kind of like to call it the failure resume. I've had various iterations of this exercise but this is where we get to talk about all the things that sucked we get to talk about and bring out to the open alright? To do an audit an inner audit of alright all of the past relationships. Let's just say you're struggling with a relationship right now or you're getting out of you're just going through a breakup or you're kind of like oh I don't know if I got to get on this dating wheel again. Or maybe you just got through a divorce. But relationships and friendships is a big category because we're not meant to do life alone. We're meant to do it in relationship with other people. So to do an audit to see alright what were all of the crazy things that happened the f*cked up things that happened, the things that you couldn't control make a list of all of those things. And there was one time where I did this with a group of students and now we have this in some of our communities where basically they just keep adding onto it. 'Cause sometimes you just remember the big things alright I had my first breakup in high school. I struggled with eating habits in college etcetera etcetera. So you'll have maybe five or 10 that really stick out of your life or a death in the family, a loss etcetera.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Abuse.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Abuse exactly. But then you'll add some of the smaller things like oh I didn't get that job that I worked so hard on. Or wow that thing that happened last year where I worked so hard on that project and I didn't get picked. And so you'll start to add these other layers and layers which is why I like to call it a failure resume because you'll add onto all of these things. But then on the other side of that alright what did that lead you to? What did that lead you to that breakup in the seventh grade? Who did that lead you to? Maybe it led you to another person in college that got you to share your theater skills on stage or the friend that maybe stole your homework or whatever the case was but it led to something else. Where did it lead you? And what were all those breadcrumbs to lead you where you are today? And it's huge for people who are kind of ruminating in the suck or maybe if you have this personality type of you're kind of constantly in your head and you're replaying all of the scenarios of why didn't it go well? And you're analyzing it and you're just in your mind. And so a way to bring it down into your body and into your heart is to well let's give voice to these parts. Let's kind of see where that roadmap took you because it took you to actually listening to this podcast here today right now.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: All of our failures and all of our setbacks led us to this particular moment right here right now you and I Shawn and that is beautiful. That's where the magic comes in. That's where we can kind of amidst the crazy and the chaotic. And sometimes the fact that the fragments of our life may be this bowl of soup but that bowl of soup led you to this exact moment which is beautiful and it's magical and maybe you're still in the healing process but you can take this. And now this is something that we do annually and so you can add to those layers but it's contributed to well how is it now for you? What did you learn about yourself in the process? What are you no longer taking forward? Maybe you've reframed a story because you found out that oh I was acting this way because my third grade teacher told me I was never going to amount to anything. So that's why I keep thinking that I'm a failure. And that's why I won't start that thing because every time I just feel like or you'll hear stories of somebody who had and I feel like I talk about this in the book but around even stuttering and how somebody made fun of you in the second grade. And then to heal and reframe that story and reposition it with something that you're saying and you're taking forward with you today here on out. And that can also be part of the healing journey.

SHAWN STEVENSON: I'm going to share this from your book as well. And again in this transition from falling to igniting you said at first during a fall you often feel like a victim. You might feel helpless, ashamed, despondent and depressed. You might feel like the universe is against you or that life is happening only to you. All of that is normal,  this is important. That was a bar right there. All of that is normal. Falling sucks big time. But when you decide to accept what has happened as the reality that can trigger the next stage. And then you move into giving a little insight into igniting. And again you dissect these more in the different sections of the book but being that this is the most difficult transition I wanted to spend a little bit more time here and I want to ask you one more thing about this and if there's anything else that jumps out that you could share because again it's the suck. It is the most difficult place. Sometimes we can't see the light. But with that being said even as I'm saying that chances are there is light that shines through every now and then. And you mentioned a little bit earlier about taking some action. And I'm curious, when we have those moments what do we do? Because it's so easy to ignore them to turn back to tell ourselves a story.

SHAWN STEVENSON: When these moments happen when we're in the suck should we or would you advocate and this is what I'm asking you this personally as well to do something to just take a step to maybe what can we do with because it all starts from our mind. It's not necessarily taking an action or do we just sit in the suck and just live there? And again is it okay that we stay there for a bit? Talk about that a little bit more for me.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Yeah. So here's the thing. I think there's two camps. There's the folks that they're fine living in the victim spiral and that's all they know. I talk a lot about four personality types. And the one that I'm talking about is there's the two specific ones where they are okay with their sadness. They are okay with feeling into the suck. They are okay with sitting in the falling stage and they're okay with having the identity as the victim. And they're the ones if you ever go to the family party it's always the oh she's the one that has the big migraine again and she is the one that's having all of these issues and...

SHAWN STEVENSON: You got a problem for every solution.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Got a problem. Exactly and loves it because that's her identity. And then you have the other side where this is the go getter, the tough ones. The alright this happened. Well I'm going to keep going. I'm going to keep going. I'm going to keep going because I learned that meditation and I read that book and I've got Shawn's book so I read that chapter so I'm going to keep pushing through. And so there's the one camp where they acknowledge fully and they sit in the suck for far too long. And then there's the other camp where they deny their emotional experience and they fully bypass it completely where they're like "nope nothing's bothering me. I'm okay. I'm all good. It could have been worse.' It's kind of like where you have a bad football play or something like that and the coach is like alright the next one's going to be better. And so with that camp they're the ones struggling to slow down and they don't even acknowledge and maybe it's okay for them to actually sit in the suck but for the other school it's really difficult because when they are in that suck it's hard to actually climb out and take action. And for those people who we're talking about.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Because it's, it is, it can be a scary place. It can take you out for a couple of years. It's where I feel like I had, and I talk about this in the book. It's one of the reasons why I was inspired to write the book because I was in my own suck of postpartum depression, and I did not even know it. And I didn't realize it until I was kind of out of it on the other side. And so, again, it's, you got to take those baby steps. And for me, in my postpartum depression, I had postpartum rage and anxiety and all of these emotions that before I wasn't okay embracing, and I wasn't okay embracing because up, I thought I had to be the strong girl. I had an identity around resilience, meaning strong. But can resiliency also mean being soft? 

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: And how long is too long to sit in the suck? Well, we've got to be able to, and researchers have shown this, it takes 60 to 90 seconds to fully feel an emotion from your body. We can acknowledge, I'm feeling angry, I'm feeling sad, I'm feeling jealous right now. I'm feeling lonely, I'm feeling depressed. We can actually take the first step to just say it out loud, because most of the time it's in our head. And if it's in our head, we're ruminating. We're making stories, we're thinking we're not good enough. We're thinking our worthiness is tied to this thing, but it's all in our head. Did we write it down? Did we journal it out? Did we say, I am feeling X? And I invite you, if you are in this place first, acknowledge it outside, outside of your body, outside of your mouth.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: And then you'll see sometimes that pressure valve, that pressure cooker that we have on ourselves, tends to release because, oh wait, I just gave voice to that. That's actually not me. That's a feeling that I've been having. So I don't have to sit in this emotion. I can actually honor it. And I go through many ways of how we can process it, move the energy, move that feeling of the emotion. But many times, where does it get stuck? What does it feel like? Do we feel tension in our body? Do we feel tension in our lower back? Do we feel tension in our shoulders, in our head? 'cause we're constantly thinking about things. Notice where you actually feel it. And then maybe, I like to do this very easy practice of just even simply putting your hand over your heart.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: You talk about this a lot, Shawn. This idea of if we can't get a hug from the closest people to us, can we give ourselves that touch of, okay, it's oxytocin. Can you give yourself that little jolt of oxytocin, that care, that love for yourself, that I am gonna take a small baby step. I am going to write this out in a journal. I'm going to get myself a cup of tea and pour back into me. I'm gonna do a ritual for myself. I'm gonna actually go outside in nature right now. So I'm not saying monumental of going and getting a session with your therapist or go finding a coach or maybe even getting the book. No, the first thing that you can do is, hey, put your hand over your heart. Just honor and acknowledge yourself that you are even actually having the awareness of what you're feeling.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: And then it's that baby step. Okay, I did that. Well, if we already know, it takes 60 to 90 seconds to feel fully in emotion and the trigger behind it and where it is in our body, then, alright, let's do some of the other practices. Let's move that energy. 'cause it's just stale energy. Let's move it out. Let's go do a workout. Let's go hiking. Let's go for a walk in nature. But getting yourself to literally and physically go outside of your comfort zone or your current environment, which is what I talk about as well. And sometimes it might be taking a walk in a different block to kind of change your perspective, because what are we also doing? Well, if we're changing our perspective, or if we're maybe going to, you don't have to go all the way across the world unless you want to or do that eat, pray, love trip. You don't have to. But maybe you can go to a different grocery store. Maybe you can go to a garden in a different part of your neighborhood that you've never seen and notice, oh, what's different here? What's unfamiliar? Because many times when you're starting to take those baby steps, what are we doing? We're rewiring and activating certain neurons in our brain. We're activating different parts of our brain. We're activating more dopamine naturally. And so that's that step of slow, slowly getting out of the funk or slowly getting out of the suck.

SHAWN STEVENSON: So we recently had on Dr. Ellen Langer, who was, she's considered the mother of mindfulness, and she's been studying the impact that our thoughts have on our biology for like 40 years. And it's phenomenal. And one of the things that she mentioned, which is what you just mentioned, is novel experiences really help to facilitate biological changes, changes with our brain, but also changes with what our body is doing. As a matter of fact, finding that this group of old men back in 1979 when she did this study, were 80 years old, alright? So, in 80 back in 1979 was like 80.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Oh wow.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Right? So she went through a lot just trying to do this study, and basically setting up the environment so that they were, it was as if they were in their youth, right? Same posters, same type of music, all this stuff. But that was the study group. The other group were just supposed to talk about those things. But just the fact that those guys, even in the control group, were in a novel environment. They were having these conversations with different people. They had improvements in their vision. They had improvements in their hearing. They had improvements in certain biometrics just by doing something novel. So I love that you mentioned this, like there's so many subtle bars that you have dropped already, but just if we are wanting to navigate our way out of the suck, putting yourself in a new environment would be helpful, even in a microway, so coupling that with, and let's just say this thing out loud. Why don't we do this because we're so f*cking busy today. We've all got all this stuff going on.

SHAWN STEVENSON: We're not taking a moment to just acknowledge like, I'm not okay. We're not taking a moment just to look at and investigate. Why do I feel the way that I feel? Why am I experiencing this pain in my body? Why am I struggling to fill in the blank, whatever it is, just taking a moment because we pick up this phone, right? And we distract ourselves and we become, we are dealing with Mark Zuckerberg suck. Yes. Zucker suck. Like we are dealing with that instead of like dealing with our own stuff. And so I'm glad that we are having this conversation, and I wanted to point us to, like, you have, everybody listening has full capability to do this work and to find so much more joy and reward and all these other things at the other side, and to know that other stuff is gonna happen, but also you're building this resiliency. And the last thing I wanna ask you about is the importance of good stress as well. Because it's not like trying to hide out from bad things or from challenges in life, but actually some good stress inputs can actually help us along this way as well.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Oh, 1000%. I mean, in the magnifying stage, or even wherever stage you may be at, it helps when we are actually putting ourselves in uncomfortable positions and being in that feeling of, alright, discomfort. It's actually a good thing. There's so much research around, I mean, we already know this by when we got to go to the gym and we know if we're lifting heavy or we're gonna be feeling it the next day, it doesn't mean that we're gonna stop going to the gym. Doesn't mean that we're gonna, Ooh, that's feeling too sore. I'm not gonna do it. But so why don't, why do we then ignore having these uncomfortable conversations or what I like to call brave conversations with a friend that slighted us, or with a family member, or with our kids or with our partner so that we can deepen the connection, we can deepen our conversations and we can even strengthen our bonds to be able to have a face-to-face conversation right now, there's studies of young people, not even like, they're so afraid to even have a face-to-face conversation.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: They'd rather ghost. So they're not going to their interviews or when they have to quit, they're quietly quitting because they don't have the capacity to actually say and have a brave conversation because ooh, that's too scary. So I'm gonna avoid it altogether. But what I like to say is, alright, what's that thing that you've been avoiding? Maybe you don't like the cold plunge. We already know that. You talk about this a lot. How does this actually affect our body? Well, it provides us with that good stress for a body to break down more fat, etcetera. But what about some of the things that we avoid that help us to have healthier relationships, that have healthier boundaries? If you are, I'm like a recovering people pleaser over here. I love to be the one the way show of my family and friends, but there was a point where I had to actually say no a lot and practice this idea of actually saying, no, I won't be able to do this.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: I would love to take you X-Y, and Z, but I just can't do it today. And to be able to acknowledge like, oh, wow, that was a big deal. I can't believe I just did that. And to pat yourself on the back when you are taking those big risks and leaps instead of avoiding it. And that's what I mean by good stress. So some of the things that I even write about in the book is, alright, you go to, you might, you were probably invited to this party. You're not gonna know anybody. Go, see who you can meet three new people. Maybe you're going to a networking event. Nobody that you know is there. Alright? See, maybe you can actually have deep conversations with one or two people. What can you learn about others completely afraid of public speaking? Go and do an improv class.

SHAWN STEVENSON: You did that too. It's amazing. Yeah.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: I mean it's, and I was completely terrified, but it's putting yourself in these uncomfortable positions. And I know that there are other people who would be like, yeah, I'd go bungee jumping or I pulled our community once. Like, what's the scariest thing that you would do and jump out of a plane? Maybe you don't need to do that if that's not you, but maybe you can actually incrementally invite good stress. Because as we tend to, let's just say you're heartbroken right now, and you're thinking, I don't wanna go on those apps. Maybe you go on that app and maybe you're not looking for the next love of your life, but you're maybe looking for somebody that matches your energy and maybe you're kind of like, okay, I'm gonna say yes to this person and see what I learn about myself in this next date.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: And it's not about anything else, but it's more about, alright, what can I learn about myself? And that's what cultivating this idea of good stress or to be able to suck at something new, that's what I also like to call it. Because then it's relieving the pressure. Then it's like we have a little sense of play. Life is, can be so serious. And I feel like once we add a little level of humor and levity towards things, then we're actually allowing ourselves to be okay in the discomfort. 'cause there's less pressure.

SHAWN STEVENSON: I love this. Can you let everybody know where to pick up a copy of your book and where to connect with you more? 

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Oh my goodness. Well, my podcast, The Brave Table, but also you can go to thatsuckednowwhat.com. And when you get the book from thatsuckednowwhat.com. We also have free resources and a five day fly forward mini meditation, as well as a 57 page digital workbook to actually help you go through all of the exercises even deeply that are in the book.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Amazing, amazing. So again, and I'm sure you got different places where people could pick up the book up on the website.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Absolutely.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Amazon, Barnes and Noble, all that good stuff. But take advantage of those bonuses because the workbook would really be helpful. I love having prompts, different things to actually pro actively do. It's such an opportunity for us to simply get things out of our heads and get them out into the world. You shared that and I was just sitting here in awe listening to that because it's so powerful just to get it out of your head, out of your body, whether it's speaking the words out loud, whether it's writing something down, but we carry it. And truly it's like it's freeing. It's releasing things when we speak it out loud. And so having prompts and support to do that is super helpful. So yeah, this has been amazing. And again, people can tune in to your podcast where they're listening to this podcast, The Brave Table. Follow You on Social, what is your IG? 

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Yeah, Neeta Bhushan on IG, on everywhere. LinkedIn, all the places, YouTube.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Amazing. Well, I appreciate you so much for coming to hang out with us. This has been awesome.

DR. NEETA BHUSHAN: Thanks so much, Shawn. Legend, OG.

SHAWN STEVENSON: Let's go. You already know. I appreciate you everybody, thank you so much for tuning in. I truly hope that you got a lot of value out of today's conversation, and I want you to keep in mind that there isn't a straight line to healing. There isn't a cookie cutter formulaic way that is going to get you from where you are to where you want to be. Things are gonna happen along the way. You're gonna have ups and downs. But that was very helpful for me going through certain things in my life. When one of my trusted advisors, Dr. Kelly Starrett actually, and he texted to me, I was dealing with an injury and he said that there isn't a straight line to healing because sometimes we can start playing these games in our mind. We're playing this virtual pinging pong match with our empowerment and with our feeling of like, this is taking too long, this is too difficult, whatever the case might be.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And there isn't any straight path to healing. And just keep that in mind because sometimes we can feel like we get this instant moment of revelation and it's supposed to be all downhill from here or uphill, whatever the case, however you wanna put it, rocket fuel taken off that whole thing. But in reality, there's going to be moments of adjustment, there's going to be challenges that come up along the way to your healing. But it is important that we have those moments of revelation as Neeta mentioned, that moment of ignition and lighting that fire and understanding, okay, now we're starting a journey, we're starting to move through this. And it might be a bumpy ride in some parts. Some parts might be super smooth sailing. But eventually, by you doing the work, by you understanding how powerful and remarkable and special and valuable you truly are, and how worthy you truly are as a human being, you are going to get there.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And I'm grateful to be on this journey with you. And also to just remind you that in this human experience, we are all gonna go through some of the craziest, most unexpected, most challenging times. But it is a beautiful part of this story. When all boils down to it, we can find beauty within the chaos. We can find gifts and joy within the mess and being able to lift ourselves up and to lift up our communities, we can start to write a different story. And we need that right now more than ever. So I invite you to look within, to spend a little bit more time in contemplation and self-assessment and self-love so that we can build ourselves up so we can be stronger for those around us. Because right now we're not doing the best as a society, but we've got to heal ourselves.

SHAWN STEVENSON: There's this wonderful statement, healer heal thyself. We've got to heal ourselves and lift ourselves up so that we can provide a better roadmap for others. And again, there isn't any cookie cutter roadmap. Keep that in mind. But there are definitely some consistencies, there are definitely some truths, there are definitely some icons along the way that can help to direct us. And it all comes again from doing the work. We wanna speak from a place of experience. There's a lot of people out here speaking from theory and that's wonderful. Theory is great, hypothesis is great, but truly when you know a thing, when you've gone through a thing and you can share that blueprint, what you did to get from here to there, there's this other wonderful statement from somebody who's become a friend. And it's crazy to be able to say this. Tony Robbins, Tony Robbins said that “success leaves clues”.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And he learned that from his mentor. Jim Rohn success leaves clues. And so learning from people like Dr. Bhushan for example, and being a part of this incredible community, we're picking up a lot of incredible proven knowledge that we can use to create the life that we truly want. Again, thank you so much for tuning in. We've got some epic masterclasses and world class guests coming your way very, very soon. So make sure to stay tuned. Take care, have an amazing day and I'll talk with you soon.

SHAWN STEVENSON: And for more after the show, make sure to head over to the modelhealthshow.com. That's where you can find all of the show notes. You can find transcriptions videos for each episode. And if you've got a comment, you can leave me a comment there as well. And please make sure to head over to iTunes and leave us a rating to let everybody know that the show is awesome. And I appreciate that so much and take care. I promise to keep giving you more powerful and powering great content to help you transform your life. Thanks for tuning in.